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Topic Starter Topic: Re: 5th largest e-quake of century

Glayven?
Glayven?

Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 12026
PostPosted: 03-22-2011 05:02 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I have to say I don't understand why people don't want/like nuclear-based energy. In terms of "normal, everyday use" it's pretty damned reliable and safe. Yes, it's dirty to mine and get rid of the waste (there are solutions but nobody wants to bear the cost of getting them implemented) and yes there's a reason to be concerned about the reactors if a disaster happens, but this event has proven that it takes some pretty fucking hardcore disasters to happen before you have begin worrying about the reactor.

It makes me wonder why they didn't have a contingency plan for the tsunami, being so close to the coast and all. :dork:




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Immortal
Immortal

Joined: 28 Jun 2005
Posts: 2374
PostPosted: 03-22-2011 05:09 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


The plant was ancient and due to be shut down.

The newer designs are incredibly safe. Cooling can take place without electricity(convection), etc...

Additionally I don't believe in conserving power as a way of adapting to future power needs. I want all the fucking power I want/need, whenever I want it.

Nuclear of some form is the only source that can supply the future I envision.




Last edited by shadd_ on 03-22-2011 05:14 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Elite
Elite

Joined: 25 Mar 2000
Posts: 8881
PostPosted: 03-22-2011 05:11 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I also heard that that plant was designed in part by Americans which is the obvious reason for any failures.




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Cool #9
Cool #9

Joined: 01 Dec 2000
Posts: 36623
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 12:47 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


GONNAFISTYA wrote:
I have to say I don't understand why people don't want/like nuclear-based energy. In terms of "normal, everyday use" it's pretty damned reliable and safe. Yes, it's dirty to mine and get rid of the waste (there are solutions but nobody wants to bear the cost of getting them implemented) and yes there's a reason to be concerned about the reactors if a disaster happens, but this event has proven that it takes some pretty fucking hardcore disasters to happen before you have begin worrying about the reactor.

It makes me wonder why they didn't have a contingency plan for the tsunami, being so close to the coast and all. :dork:


I'm generally against nuclear power plants. Not because of the dangers but because of the radio active waste product. The only way to get safely rid of that is to stash it in deep underground bunkers for tens of thousands of years.

I'm pretty damn sure the human race is incapable of planning ahead that far.



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Etile
Etile

Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Posts: 26789
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 09:57 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


GONNAFISTYA wrote:
lol @ stupid yanks that freaked out and bought anti-radiation meds :dork:


this is why all the western reporting on fukushima etc has to have its western-risk-averse-tinted filter removed before consumption

lol, even the normally gung-ho pro-nuke uk conservatives are now having second thoughts about building new plants - in spite of the fact that a) we're thousands of miles from a major fault line, b) we're well-protected against tsunamis due to being surrounded by irish, french, spanish, dutchees (finally useful for something, thanks fags) etc, c) if the current generation of nuke plants aren't replaced the lights will start going out within 10 years, d) the alternatives are currently inadequate vis a vis replacing nuke plants, and e) the plants they *would* build - if they did - would be newer and safer than fukushima

having said that, roll on fusion




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foolproof
foolproof

Joined: 11 Jan 2001
Posts: 7285
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 11:14 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I think nuclear power is absolutely the way to go, especially if the focus would shift more to nuclear *fusion* (less by-product).
All alternatives < nuclear power.

This whole Fukushima debacle seems so fucking retarded when you think about it;
When building the plant they had some very imbecile safety measures implemented;
They thought it was adequate for the plant to withstand 7 meter waves and an 8.3 quake.
Build that fucker 10 meters higher, you cunts, ffs.

The reactions in other countries about using nuclear power is pretty ridiculous.
Especially Germany where they're getting all hysterical about closing plants.
You'd almost want a fucking earth quake and tsunami to strike there, if it weren't for the fact that it hasn't happened for the past 10.000 years and will not happen for the next.




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Intoxicated
Intoxicated

Joined: 26 Sep 2001
Posts: 20739
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 11:53 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


nucular powar melts babbies :!:




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Etile
Etile

Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Posts: 26789
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 12:57 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


THAT'S HOW IS BABBY MALFORMED




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Glayven?
Glayven?

Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 12026
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 03:09 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Not to sound like a cock, but listening to the "scardey cat" reporting and 20 year-old fears of nuclear energy, I'm pretty convinced if a nuclear power plant suffered/survived an 8.9 scale earthquake, a huge tsunami, conducted a smash-up derby in the core room and then had Haley's comet slam into it at 25,000 mph...which miraculously didn't cause a meltdown but "created a risk of a meltdown"...people would still complain about nuclear energy.

Why is it people only think scientists are dumb when they're dealing with issues that are potentially dangerous? I firmly believe that modern nuclear facilities are as safe to those around them as the LHC is to those fucking frenchies drinking wine above it.




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 08 Apr 2001
Posts: 21784
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 03:34 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


People are stupid, this "everyone has a voice thing" is getting old, stupid people need shutting up.




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 02 Mar 2000
Posts: 13576
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 03:48 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


slippery slope there EtUL




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 08 Apr 2001
Posts: 21784
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 04:10 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Nah I'm fine with genocide too.




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 02 Mar 2000
Posts: 13576
PostPosted: 03-23-2011 07:24 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


you passed the test...welcome aboard :paranoid:




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Cool #9
Cool #9

Joined: 01 Dec 2000
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PostPosted: 03-23-2011 11:22 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Plan B wrote:
I think nuclear power is absolutely the way to go, especially if the focus would shift more to nuclear *fusion* (less by-product).


Nuclear fusion is still some way from being a viable way to produce energy.

Plan B wrote:
All alternatives < nuclear power.


Like I said before, I'm sure the nuclear fission process is safe enough, but what about the radioactive waste? What is the right way to deal with that? I think this is a problem that's big enough to warrant some second thoughts about nuclear power.



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Elite
Elite

Joined: 02 Mar 2000
Posts: 13576
PostPosted: 03-24-2011 06:04 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


"Fossil fuels: Deadlier than nuclear radiation"
http://www.mnn.com/health/fitness-well- ... -radiation




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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft

Joined: 01 Mar 2001
Posts: 17305
PostPosted: 03-28-2011 09:25 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Quote:
SHINO YUASA Associated Press

TOKYO — Workers discovered new pools of radioactive water leaking from Japan's crippled nuclear complex, officials said Monday, as emergency crews struggled to pump out hundreds of tons of contaminated water and bring the plant back under control.

Officials believe the contaminated water has sent radioactivity levels soaring at the coastal complex, and caused more radiation to seep into soil and seawater.

The Fukushima Daiichi power plant, 220 kilometres northeast of Tokyo, was crippled March 11 when a tsunami spawned by a powerful earthquake slammed into Japan's northeastern coast.

The huge wave engulfed much of the complex, and destroyed the crucial power systems needed to cool the complex's nuclear fuel rods.

Since then, three of the complex's six units are believed to have partially melted down, and emergency crews have struggled with everything from malfunctioning pumps to dangerous spikes in radiation that have forced temporary evacuations.

Confusion at the plant has intensified fears that the nuclear crisis will last weeks, months or years amid alarms over radiation making its way into produce, raw milk and even tap water as far away as Tokyo.

The troubles at the Fukushima complex have eclipsed Pennsylvania's 1979 crisis at Three Mile Island, when a partial meltdown raised fears of widespread radiation release, but is still well short of the 1986 Chernobyl disaster, which killed at least 31 people with radiation sickness, raised long-term cancer rates, and spewed radiation for hundreds of kilometres.

While parts of the Japanese plant has been reconnected to the power grid, the contaminated water — which has now been found in numerous places around the complex, including the basements of several buildings — must be pumped out before electricity can be restored to the cooling system.

That has left officials struggling with two sometimes-contradictory efforts: pumping in water to keep the fuel rods cool and pumping out — and then safely storing — contaminated water.

Hidehiko Nishiyama, a spokesman for Japan's Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, called that balance “very delicate work.”

He also said workers were still looking for safe ways to store the radioactive water.

“We are exploring all means,” he said.

The buildup of radioactive water first became a problem last week, when it splashed over the boots of two workers, burning them and prompting a temporary suspension of work.

Then on Monday, officials with Tokyo Electric Power Co., which owns and runs the complex, said that workers had found more radioactive water in deep trenches used for pipes and electrical wiring outside three units.

The contaminated water has been emitting radiation exposures more than four times the amount that the government considers safe for workers.

The five workers in the area at the time were not hurt, said TEPCO spokesman Takashi Kurita.

Exactly where the water is coming from remains unclear, though many suspect it is cooling water that has leaked from one of the disabled reactors.

It could take weeks to pump out the radioactive water, said Gary Was, a nuclear engineering professor at the University of Michigan.

“Battling the contamination so workers can work there is going to be an ongoing problem,” he said.

Meanwhile, new readings showed ocean contamination had spread 1.6 kilometres farther north of the nuclear site than before but is still within the 20-kilometre radius of the evacuation zone.

Radioactive iodine-131 was discovered offshore at a level 1,150 times higher than normal, Nishiyama, a spokesman for the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, told reporters.

Amid reports that people had been sneaking back into the mandatory evacuation zone around the nuclear complex, the chief government spokesman again urged residents to stay out. Yukio Edano said contaminants posed a “big” health risk in that area.

Gregory Jaczko, head of the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission, arrived in Tokyo on Monday to meet with Japanese officials and discuss the situation, the U.S. Embassy said in a statement.

“The unprecedented challenge before us remains serious, and our best experts remain fully engaged to help Japan,” Jaczko was quoted as saying.



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seremtan wrote: yeah, it's not like the japanese are advanced enough to be able to decontaminate any areas that might be affected :dork:


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Karot!
Karot!

Joined: 31 Jul 2001
Posts: 17734
PostPosted: 03-28-2011 11:58 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Are you ever going to post anything other than single sentences and quotes from articles?

How about you distill that horrid fucking wall of text and make it into a bit of fact based opinion for us to read and comment on, that would be nice. Not that there's anything wrong with the average forum user's capacity of doing it themselves, but it would be good practice for you i feel. Regurgitating information like this is intellectually lazy don't you know, seems to me like you ought to work on your information comprehension and reproduction skills.

Have at it. :arrow:



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Digital Nausea
Digital Nausea

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PostPosted: 03-28-2011 12:30 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


lol shut up




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Karot!
Karot!

Joined: 31 Jul 2001
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PostPosted: 03-28-2011 12:36 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


<3



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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft

Joined: 01 Mar 2001
Posts: 17305
PostPosted: 03-28-2011 12:51 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Ryoki wrote:
Are you ever going to post anything other than single sentences and quotes from articles?

How about you distill that horrid fucking wall of text and make it into a bit of fact based opinion for us to read and comment on, that would be nice. Not that there's anything wrong with the average forum user's capacity of doing it themselves, but it would be good practice for you i feel. Regurgitating information like this is intellectually lazy don't you know, seems to me like you ought to work on your information comprehension and reproduction skills.

Have at it. :arrow:

I would but I can't be bothered. Feel free to put me on ignore or skip my posts.




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Intoxicated
Intoxicated

Joined: 26 Sep 2001
Posts: 20739
PostPosted: 03-29-2011 02:28 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


lol, told, fair play :)

tbh, and although probably guilty of this, unless someone posts why they find so-and-so quote/link interesting, i do tend to skip over them.
knee-jerk reaction from years of goof threads maybe.




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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft

Joined: 01 Mar 2001
Posts: 17305
PostPosted: 03-29-2011 03:01 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Not that his criticism of me isn't valid, but after Ryoki's post I went back and took a look at what he has contributed to this thread. What exactly did you add of worth Ryoki? A few one sentence posts (the horror), and getting trolled by the most obvious troll on the internet?

Suck my dick Guyblowki. :olo: <3

ya diiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiick




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 02 Mar 2000
Posts: 13576
PostPosted: 03-29-2011 05:55 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


you just can't let shit go can you? ffs you're pretty bad about shit like that...I bet you're always the one killing a good time cause you just don't have the good sense of when to quit.




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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft

Joined: 01 Mar 2001
Posts: 17305
PostPosted: 03-29-2011 06:18 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


i guess that's why i have no friends. :(

i'm sorry ryoki




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Linux Version
Linux Version

Joined: 04 Dec 1999
Posts: 2515
PostPosted: 03-29-2011 08:17 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote





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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft

Joined: 01 Mar 2001
Posts: 17305
PostPosted: 03-29-2011 08:22 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Yep it's pretty fucked. No exposure to radiation is safe by the way (according to the National Academy of Sciences) despite all these pronouncements that risks to health are low. If you ingest this stuff it's bad news.




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foolproof
foolproof

Joined: 11 Jan 2001
Posts: 7285
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 06:45 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Eraser wrote:
...what about the radioactive waste?...


I agree that's a huge problem.
Storing it in a "safe place" (deeply burried/shot into space) doesn't really sound like a convincing long term solution.
But even taking that into account I think it's doable, and the benefits outweigh this drawback.




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Etile
Etile

Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Posts: 26789
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 08:57 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


HM-PuFFNSTuFF wrote:
Yep it's pretty fucked. No exposure to radiation is safe by the way (according to the National Academy of Sciences) despite all these pronouncements that risks to health are low. If you ingest this stuff it's bad news.


didn't do your mum any harm

oh wai-









...boom...




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Immortal
Immortal

Joined: 28 Jun 2005
Posts: 2374
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 09:09 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Interesting chart that can help put radiation exposure into perspective.

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uplo ... -chart.jpg




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 02 Mar 2000
Posts: 13576
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 10:31 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


hey, where is the little square that puts this incident into perspective?




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I'm the dude!
I'm the dude!

Joined: 04 Feb 2002
Posts: 10428
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 10:41 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Maybe it has something to do with the one labeled, "Fukushima". I'm not sure though, it's just a guess. :dork:


Even more into perspective, at 250 mSv radiation sickness starts to occur, nausea, fatigue and vomiting can occur within hours at this level of exposure.

10,000 mSv is lethal. Hair loss, hemorrhaging could develop over a period of months followed by death.



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Last edited by obsidian on 03-30-2011 10:45 AM, edited 1 time in total.

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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft

Joined: 01 Mar 2001
Posts: 17305
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 10:44 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Right now there are places 25 miles away from the reactors (this would be in the voluntary evacuation zone) where one would get a year's maximum dose of radiation in 10 hours. (100 microsievert per hour.)




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Elite
Elite

Joined: 02 Mar 2000
Posts: 13576
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 11:13 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
Maybe it has something to do with the one labeled, "Fukushima". I'm not sure though, it's just a guess. :dork:

.

didn't see it :toothy:

ps
FU




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Linux Version
Linux Version

Joined: 04 Dec 1999
Posts: 2515
PostPosted: 03-30-2011 11:23 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


shadd_ wrote:
Interesting chart that can help put radiation exposure into perspective.

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uplo ... -chart.jpg


Why the hell'd they cut the picture in half?

http://xkcd.com/radiation/




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Linux Version
Linux Version

Joined: 04 Dec 1999
Posts: 2515
PostPosted: 03-31-2011 09:26 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


http://allthingsnuclear.org/post/421319 ... nation-far

This is reporting that the levels of soil contamination up to 40km away is ridiculously high. The amount found in villages that far away from Japan's plant is 2.5 times the lower limit of the red zone on this map.

Image




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