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Topic Starter Topic: Re: Cyberpunk 2077

Shambolic
Shambolic
Joined: 11 Apr 2000
Posts: 8024
PostPosted: 12-07-2020 04:11 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Witcher 3 was buggy on release too. I remember it having frequent CTDs.
That came good eventually though, so fingers crossed.




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Arrr?
Arrr?
Joined: 09 Feb 2001
Posts: 35460
PostPosted: 12-07-2020 06:39 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It's just as well, I can't find a 3070 anywhere. :paranoid:

Also there's this: https://kotaku.com/40-boxes-of-rtx-3090 ... 1845828729




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Aneurysm
Aneurysm
Joined: 10 Dec 1999
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PostPosted: 12-08-2020 08:35 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


If you live near a Microcenter that is probably your best chance. afaik they aren’t listing their stock or selling 3000 series online yet so you can get lucky and find one on the shelf without competing with bots.




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 52133
PostPosted: 12-08-2020 08:58 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Yes, American folks are getting walk in cards at Microcenters :up:




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Legend
Legend
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 16498
PostPosted: 12-08-2020 10:38 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I just placed an order on a Ryzen 5900x because Geoff can't afford it.




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Mew Legs!
Mew Legs!
Joined: 23 Jul 2006
Posts: 1112
PostPosted: 12-09-2020 09:31 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Valve pushed out proton-5.13-4, fixing functionality and I had to buy it. Guess I'll try it out tomorrow.




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Legend
Legend
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 16498
PostPosted: 12-09-2020 10:26 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Game runs really smooth on my 2080 Ti, 1440p and ultra settings with RT on low. I think a 3080 Ti will really hit the sweet spot.




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Aneurysm
Aneurysm
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PostPosted: 12-10-2020 12:12 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Medium raytraced preset with dlss on performance is the only way i can keep it above 60fps @4k. Disabling dlss cut frames in half. There is definitely more tweaking to be done. Digital Foundry on youtube usually puts out videos with detailed graphical analysis of each setting for new games.

The game looks fucking phenomenal I don’t think the videos did it justice.




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Cool #9
Cool #9
Joined: 01 Dec 2000
Posts: 44136
PostPosted: 12-10-2020 12:27 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Not a bad idea to wait for first patch :)




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Kempston Joy
Kempston Joy
Joined: 11 Aug 2000
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PostPosted: 12-10-2020 12:27 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Will run fine on the Xbox SX.




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 52133
PostPosted: 12-10-2020 12:33 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


shaft wrote:
Medium raytraced preset with dlss on performance is the only way i can keep it above 60fps @4k. Disabling dlss cut frames in half. There is definitely more tweaking to be done. Digital Foundry on youtube usually puts out videos with detailed graphical analysis of each setting for new games.

The game looks fucking phenomenal I don’t think the videos did it justice.


They put a little preview up saying that it's basically the best looking game there has ever been when everything is enabled.




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Canadian Shaft
Canadian Shaft
Joined: 01 Mar 2001
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PostPosted: 12-10-2020 06:20 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


post your pud, your cyber pud




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Welfare Recipient
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Joined: 02 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: 12-10-2020 10:32 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Beat it on ultra settings... Meh okay game...




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Welfare Recipient
Welfare Recipient
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: 12-10-2020 10:35 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


If ur a moron...




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Lead Pipe Mafia
Lead Pipe Mafia
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 5945
PostPosted: 12-10-2020 10:45 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


You cheat at chess buddy so I'll take any claims from you with a grain of salt.




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
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PostPosted: 12-10-2020 01:58 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


:olo:




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Etile
Etile
Joined: 19 Nov 2003
Posts: 34898
PostPosted: 12-10-2020 03:17 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Κracus wrote:
You cheat at chess buddy so I'll take any claims from you with a grain of salt.


geoff is a chessological technician

i.e. he puts the pieces back in the starting position for the real players




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Who's that man, Mommy?
Who's that man, Mommy?
Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Posts: 5316
PostPosted: 12-12-2020 03:40 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Currently playing the game.

Great setting, great main story and side stories.

But while I'm having a blast due to the writing, the game does not feel fresh. None of the gameplay elements are anything new. If you played Deus Ex 3: That's your combat and sneaking (plus some hacking). If you drove through the GTA3 city: That's your open-world. There's not much more going on.

This review is spot on in describing the shortcomings:

Cyberpunk 2077 review — A look at the present, not the future

Quote:
So despite how alive the city feels due to its mind-blowing ray-traced lighting, it’s still sterile. Things don’t just happen in Night City. At its heart, Cyberpunk 2077 is a map game. You choose a quest off the menu and then go and do whatever the developer designed for you.

...

If the game wants, you can sit back and drink a beer with a friend, but this is not something you can initiate on your own.

...

The problem is that the world of Cyberpunk 2077 suggests so much possibility. The megabuildings that make up the city’s skyline suggests vast interior spaces that don’t really exist. Merchants with a finite number of eurodollars suggests a simulated economy that isn’t in the game. The bustling streets suggests the potential for emergent story moments that almost never really happen.



It's a great game but it's no revelation. Then again: Just having turned off my PS, I still want to jump right back into this world.




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Who's that man, Mommy?
Who's that man, Mommy?
Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Posts: 5316
PostPosted: 12-12-2020 03:55 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


scared? wrote:
Beat it on ultra settings...


What's your graphic settings got to do with beating the game?

But agreed: The game is not very hard. Mostly because the AI is often insultingly stupid: The enemies mostly don't attack or circle you and so "duck, cover, sniper rifle" solves everything. Even more so since sniper rifles can hit through walls.




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Digital Nausea
Digital Nausea
Joined: 10 Feb 2001
Posts: 24710
PostPosted: 12-13-2020 03:33 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


So how long should I wait to play this game? 6 months to fix the bugs?




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Cool #9
Cool #9
Joined: 01 Dec 2000
Posts: 44136
PostPosted: 12-13-2020 03:45 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


xer0s wrote:
So you won’t play until 2022. Got it...

:shrug:




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Digital Nausea
Digital Nausea
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PostPosted: 12-13-2020 03:52 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


¯\_(ツ)_/¯




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Lead Pipe Mafia
Lead Pipe Mafia
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 05:15 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Honestly I'm enjoying the shit out of it. I'm playing it on an Xbox one X. Story is fun and enjoyable, I just finished the AI driver missions yesterday and they were great, I was expecting the same rinse and repeat type of mission when I started the first one but they were all unique even though the mission goal was effectively the same. The shortcomings of this game is mainly the AI though, the cars driving around and pedestrians reactions to things around them aren't realistic at all. Otherwise the game sucks you in with the atmosphere of being in such a large city or being in an underground cyberpunk nightclub etc... the settings are the real gem. I have heard it's not so good on older consoles though...




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
Posts: 52133
PostPosted: 12-14-2020 06:01 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-55301721

Quote:
The makers of one of most anticipated games of the year have apologised and offered refunds amid a backlash from gamers about performance problems.




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Digital Nausea
Digital Nausea
Joined: 10 Feb 2001
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 06:53 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Sounds like I just need to buy a Series X and wait until March to play...




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Cool #9
Cool #9
Joined: 01 Dec 2000
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 07:18 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I understand the game isn't even released for PS5/XBox Series X yet? At least, you can buy it for those systems but you're getting the emulated PS4/XBox One versions of the game, not the full fledged next gen version you'd play on PC?




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 07:41 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


That's about right - though I also believe it's an Nvidia sponsored title, so it will have more glitz on the PC version for obvious reasons...in case they are not obvious; the consoles run on AMD tech and Nvidia don't want the really nice looking game on the AMD consoles yet because it'll take the shine of the PC version.




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Legend
Legend
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Posts: 16498
PostPosted: 12-14-2020 08:48 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Don Carlos wrote:
Nvidia don't want the really nice looking game on the AMD consoles yet


Consoles can't handle modern games without gimping down the lighting effects, AI, and physics computations. Even with the newest models, they can't achieve true 4K at 60fps despite all the marketing hype.

Nvidia isn't limiting anything, there's only so much you can get out of a closed-up plastic box that's trying to cut as many corners as possible to keep costs down.




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 12:57 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Captain Mazda wrote:
Don Carlos wrote:
Nvidia don't want the really nice looking game on the AMD consoles yet


Nvidia isn't limiting anything, there's only so much you can get out of a closed-up plastic box that's trying to cut as many corners as possible to keep costs down.


While I fully appreciate that the consoles are not as good as a high end GFX card, a PC costing the same as a console couldn't run CP2077 anywhere near as well as a latest gen console. That being said, there are no PCs that can run CP2077 at 4k60 with all the bells and whistles on. Even with DLSS upsampling from 1080p, it drops frames.

Back to the consoles, the reason why games are run so well on consoles is exactly because they are a closed up plastic box. They know exactly what they are programming for and can tweak and optimise to get an experience close to that of a medium to high end PC for £450. Currently you are running backwards compat for CP2077, not with native new console support. Lets see what happens with when the native versions arrive.




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Legend
Legend
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 01:44 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Don Carlos wrote:
While I fully appreciate that the consoles are not as good as a high end GFX card, a PC costing the same as a console couldn't run CP2077 anywhere near as well as a latest gen console. That being said, there are no PCs that can run CP2077 at 4k60 with all the bells and whistles on. Even with DLSS upsampling from 1080p, it drops frames.


Yeah but I wasn't claiming that. If I was only into gaming, I couldn't justify building a high-end rig and maintaining it. But since I use it as a workstation most of the time, the gaming potential is a bonus. Although with the way consoles are becoming obsolete faster, the cost gap is closing compared to a custom PC.

In order to have the convenience and relatively cheap cost of a console—although it adds up with overpriced games, expensive peripherals built to break, online subscription services, etc.—the performance and graphics quality has to suck compared to a PC. Problem is hardcore console fans don't understand this, so they're review-bombing a game that looks and runs great on high-end hardware where it was meant to be played.

No single GPU on the market can run the latest and most graphics-heavy games at ultra settings in 4K 60fps. There are a lot of dumbass PC gamers with money to burn that don't realize this and get mad when Cyberpunk makes their cards squeal. 1440p 144hz is the sweet spot right now for maximum quality and performance.




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Unquantifiable Abstract
Unquantifiable Abstract
Joined: 31 Dec 1969
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PostPosted: 12-14-2020 02:47 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


This is an interesting topic to me and one that rears it's head every new console cycle, so I am still happy to chat about it.

Captain Mazda wrote:
Yeah but I wasn't claiming that. If I was only into gaming, I couldn't justify building a high-end rig and maintaining it. But since I use it as a workstation most of the time, the gaming potential is a bonus. Although with the way consoles are becoming obsolete faster, the cost gap is closing compared to a custom PC


So what did you mean by this?

Captain Mazda wrote:
Consoles can't handle modern games without gimping down the lighting effects, AI, and physics computations. Even with the newest models, they can't achieve true 4K at 60fps despite all the marketing hype.


I'd also argue the point about PCs being more affordable. For even a mid range GFX card you are looking at £400 now. PC gaming is not cheap, it never has been and certainly is not at the moment.

As slight aside, I think there is a difference between raw performance and experience (which is something else I will touch on later). While the PS5 might have titles that can't match the fidelity of a high end PC, as an experience when it comes to loading etc, it's in a different league. Now, I have 2 very fast NVME M.2 drives in my PC which can load things very nicely indeed (I am also running an X570 mobo with 32gb of RAM, so yes, I can run both at full PCIE 4.0) but on games that have been optimised for the PS5, there is no comparison. You go from console dash board to playing a game in 3 or 4 seconds and that shiz makes a difference. Instant reloads in game when you die, stuff like that is noticeable when you come back to PC gaming.

Captain Mazda wrote:
In order to have the convenience and relatively cheap cost of a console—although it adds up with overpriced games, expensive peripherals built to break, online subscription services, etc.—the performance and graphics quality has to suck compared to a PC. Problem is hardcore console fans don't understand this, so they're review-bombing a game that looks and runs great on high-end hardware where it was meant to be played.


Expensive peripherals are certainly a thing, but built to break? I don't think I've ever broken anything for a console. I mean, I have almost destroyed a PS3 pad with beer but nothing has structurally, mechanically or electronically broken for me. Which I would say could be luck, but I've owned almost every major console since the Mega drive.

You have people review bombing a game because it runs at 15fps for good portions of time on a console it has been released for. And rightly so, in my opinion. You cannot release a game on a console and have it perform that badly and expect people to be OK with it. It's going to be a terrible experience and that will taint your view of the game because that is the game you are playing and experiencing on that machine.

Example; If you were going to release a book and had hyped it up to be the best story ever told so you got loads of pre-orders, then get the book printed with black letters on slightly less black paper for 90% of the copies you are sending to your audience, those people who receive the black on black books are quite rightly going to be annoyed. You'll strain your eyes trying to read it, get fed up and wonder why it was ever released in such a state, which is is what you'll tell people because it's the experience you've had. Having a few select people who have it printed in standard black on white who can tell you it's the best story ever and a wonderful experience isn't going to change your opinion or experience of it. It might leave you open to coming back to it in the future when you might have access to an easier to read version and your opinion of it might change after that, but it changes nothing in the here and now when it comes to your interaction with said book. And it's the same for this game. People were sold a beautiful, vibrant world and they've ended up with an ugly, choppy mess that verges on unplayable at times.

Captain Mazda wrote:
No single GPU on the market can run the latest and most graphics-heavy games at ultra settings in 4K 60fps. There are a lot of dumbass PC gamers with money to burn that don't realize this and get mad when Cyberpunk makes their cards squeal. 1440p 144hz is the sweet spot right now for maximum quality and performance.


True that :up:




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Lead Pipe Mafia
Lead Pipe Mafia
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 5945
PostPosted: 12-15-2020 04:44 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


In regards to built to break I'd say there's some truth in that. I found a loophole though because xbox controllers break far too easily from regular play, well, by my standards anyway. I just paid extra for the extended warranty on xbox controllers and inevitably after a year the controllers bumper button would stop working after 4 - 6 months, I'd swap it for a new one and again pay 10$ for the extended warranty. I've gone through roughly a dozen controllers at 10$ a piece for OEM new Xbox controllers. That was when I played rocketleague and used bumper for the boost button though. Either way, those controllers were not built to last.




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Messatsu Ko Jy-ouu
Messatsu Ko Jy-ouu
Joined: 24 Nov 2000
Posts: 44139
PostPosted: 12-16-2020 08:04 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Not sure what kind of oaf you are, but I own the first generation controllers of every console I've ever owned (ie pretty much all out there except for n64 and wii) and I have never had a controller break on me. They've all been used for hours on end, and the last generation's by my kids as well.
The only time I had an issue with an Xbox controller was when the thumbstick broke internally when I clicked it. i mean it still worked but you could hear something rattling inside. Called MS and - even tho it was years old and out of warranty - sent me a new one cost free. Thanks EU consumer laws :up:
That said there are differences in quality though. The Switch joycons are clearly cheaply made as the class action lawsuit going on right now can attest to.

On topic. Everything Don Carlos says is true. Obviously a console will never match a top of the line PC build a month after said console has been released. (Tangent: always amusing when some pcmasterrace type person will point that out only not to own a pc build that matches the new gen anyway. My guy who are you preaching to?).

That is not to say that whatever software is being released on it should work on that hardware. Cyberpunk does not. That's on CDPR and not on the consumer who "shouldve bought a pc".
Remember the Batman Arkham pc port? Or Dark Souls, or GTA? Even the best pcs couldn't run these properly. "Just get it on console" would not have been a proper solution.
It also shows that the issue is often not hardware capacity but software optimisation. Something that costs money and in case of ports is ideally skipped by the devs.

As for the game itself. The people who are actually in that pc sweetspot build are noticing another issue; that the game is actually quite bland. It tries to be both Deus Ex and GTA and fails at both, resulting in an empty world and shallow gameplay. Not what you would expect from the creators of the Witcher series.
This is what I read mind, I'm sure there are enough people who are enjoying the game and more power to them :up:




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Lead Pipe Mafia
Lead Pipe Mafia
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: 12-16-2020 08:57 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I agree that the game is shallow. Outside of the story missions there's not much to do. Similar could be said of GTAO but at least that was online near launch.

I'm hopefully optimistic that they'll patch the AI and give it a bit more realism, fix the police spawn issues and add some dynamic missions from random NPC's down the road. Maybe also add stuff that's missing like minigames, racing, barber shops etc...

There's other stuff too that's glaringly bad, like how your car doesn't sound any different when you drive through a tunnel, which there are lots of, it's minor yes, but just really strange that they'd spend 8 years on a title and miss stuff like that. I'm optimistic though because one thing I noticed is that almost every door seems to be one you can interact with in the game however the majority are locked and cannot be unlocked. I'm kinda hoping if there's ever an online that they'll become shops and apartments for users to buy, stuff like that. There's so much potential.

Also it's not a matter of me being an Oaf, more likely you're just extremely weak. I can't imagine a fully working N64 controller in this day and age. I don't know any of my friends that haven't had to deal with stick drift and the eventual loss of bumper buttons, this is especially true if you play Rocketleague in any serious manner. I use bumper a lot in racing games and in RL and they just aren't built to be in constant use. It's a pretty common fault if you look it up online. I have separate controllers for my kids vs me too to avoid unnecessary wear as I thought perhaps that was the cause but no, it's just not built to be durable. Also, I fix this kind of stuff for a living... I can actually show you the weak spot causing the problem, it's literally a small piece of plastic that's obviously going to wear out fast.




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Messatsu Ko Jy-ouu
Messatsu Ko Jy-ouu
Joined: 24 Nov 2000
Posts: 44139
PostPosted: 12-16-2020 09:04 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I prefer the term self-controlled :p




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