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Topic Starter Topic: Re: [Quake 3] Return to the Cistern (tabq1dm5)

Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 306
PostPosted: 10-27-2009 02:06 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Hi Tabun,

I really like what you've done with the non-pure version and the changes you have made since the original beta. Thankyou for taking the time to share this with us, and for bringing back some fond memories.

In terms of the new alternate teleporter exit I think it works really well and I like it. It gives the dead end (even though it isn't really any more) a sense of purpose an brings that alcove into pay much more in the map.

In terms of the exit from the pit there and bot play I think that's fine.

I watched a couple of games on the one to the upper level and I think it's not the YA / Spawn point or the RL that causes the attraction. It's the three small healths. Often they went for these prior to going for the YA (in fact I didn't see one head off for the RL), and more often than not they took just one or two of them. I would suggest as a quick test removing them altogether, especially as there is a yellow health just around the corner that might attract / encourage more play in the RL room.


As for the water I think you done a great job here, they seem to move in and out fairly smoothly and don't spend nearly as much time in there as they used to. Well done on that.

The only shortcut addition of socks I didn't like was the one from the PG to the button. I think it detracts from the great gameplay that can be had around the curved stairs. But that's just me being an old fart who has fond memories of playing the original many many times.

Perhaps it's time to wrap this up, finish those final tweaks and move on :)

Ian.



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Warrior
Warrior
Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 76
PostPosted: 10-27-2009 04:52 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


AEon wrote:
The reason why that one connecting shortcut (lower PG to upper RL) is so popular is probably threefold:
  • Right on the tiled floor on the upper level you have a player respawn point, placing bots right next to this "critical" area.
  • Bots seem to have a preference for the PG *and* the RL (normal), so they will wander between the two weapons.
  • And since a YA is also close by the bots will roam this area in particular.
What you could try is removing the player respawn point here, to reduce the focus on this area somewhat. E.g. place it inside the RL room near the hole or so. Might be "funny" to place the respawn exactly above the hole and have the player drop into the lower water area ;)


I've now placed that spawn between the RL-room hole and the pillar -- that actually looks like a neat place for it, too. And no, not above it. :p The spawn in the hallway was a bit too much out in the open, anyway.
Edit: I see now that you didn't mean the lower, but the upper spawn. I think the lower causes more problems, since they only use the shortcut going up?

Quote:
Since I suggested changing the alternate TP exit, I like the exit near the LG. It gives the player access to the less frequented lower water area. I'm not quite sure the bots use this "secret" TP path though.


They do. Not so often as "normal" use, though.

Quote:
Even though the r_speeds are not really an issue with about 9K. But looking towards the water room, from the double-TP room, all the water room is drawn, IMO this should *really* not be happening. A final :ninja: hint brush might be in order to better cut off the pool area.


I know that would be neater for r_speeds. It would endlessly cut up a lot of portals. I'm currently happy with the balance between portals (3.3k and r_speeds (max 11k).

Quote:
BTW, I only recently remembered cluster portals: I no longer remember when they were actually useful (required). But those might be able to "balance" the bot play a bit, i.e. help the bots not considder large parts of the map for navigation, but stick to the current room.

To all: Did we have a good tutorial on cluster portals?

[/quote]

I'm not going there. The map is already cut up in relatively simple areas, so I expect hard work with hardly any results.

---

foralarx2k3 wrote:
It's the three small healths. Often they went for these prior to going for the YA (in fact I didn't see one head off for the RL), and more often than not they took just one or two of them. I would suggest as a quick test removing them altogether (...)


Hmm, that makes sense. They're there for the tourney effect - would provide helpful sound hints to the "down" player, while the other was trying to control the upper area. Or so I'd hoped. :]

Quote:
I really like what you've done with the non-pure version and the changes you have made since the original beta. Thankyou for taking the time to share this with us, and for bringing back some fond memories.


You're very welcome. This has been very useful to me, too. ;]



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Warrior
Warrior
Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 76
PostPosted: 10-28-2009 07:29 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Ok. It's done. I've tweaked the last few lights and made a special little decal for the teleporter destination, as I have decided to keep the alternative.
My thanks to all who commented here.

Download final: tabq1dm5.zip



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Boink!
Boink!
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 4493
PostPosted: 10-28-2009 07:31 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Link seems to be no workie?!

Update: Yo, now the download link works.




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Warrior
Warrior
Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 76
PostPosted: 10-28-2009 07:41 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Should work - maybe it was still uploading? Works fine for me, anyway...



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Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 399
PostPosted: 10-29-2009 02:03 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Alternate link: http://q3a.ath.cx/?mapdetails=tabq1dm5.

;). Love the map. Great work.



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Commander
Commander
Joined: 25 Mar 2002
Posts: 120
PostPosted: 10-30-2009 10:59 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Really lovely map, Tabun. Excellent texture and shader work, as well as all the little details. It makes me think of what Quake could be like today, if they'd have kept making them, instead of turning it into the Borg from Star Trek.

This is seriously only your second released map? Very impressive.




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Warrior
Warrior
Joined: 07 Aug 2009
Posts: 76
PostPosted: 10-30-2009 03:00 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Thanks guys.

And yes. I did make a handful of maps for Quake II waay back, but I've only just started getting serious on this mapping thing. ;]



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