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q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
https://www.quake3world.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=43254		 Page 1 of 4
Author:  fKd [ 03-27-2010 05:22 PM ]
Post subject:  q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
hello all!

well, i've been working on this little 2-3 v 2-3 ctf map for a few weeks now and thought it would be handy to get some feedback from the community. i've not really done any major clipping yet and the textures are not finals. in fact nothing is lol

so yeah all feedback would be greatly appreciated :D enjoy! (i hope)

the file: http://www.filefront.com/16043421/undefined

and some screens:




cheers everyone :D
Author:  fKd [ 03-27-2010 08:44 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
tumble weed :D heh
Author:  deqer [ 03-27-2010 10:37 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Rename the map to fkctf13. :)

I will try the map soon.
Author:  fKd [ 03-27-2010 10:45 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
why rename it?
Author:  v1l3 [ 03-27-2010 10:51 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
I like it alot, It Runs Great on My Machine!!!! I figured you might like to hear that. :D It's really a cool map though, I really like the layout..it's original. It kind of reminds me of a couple other really large maps(layout-wise), but I can't put my finger on them. Nice to see different gameplay route options, plus the overlook..makes a good defense spot also.
Author:  fKd [ 03-27-2010 10:56 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
cheers. good to hear ya machine likes it :D
Author:  deqer [ 03-27-2010 11:07 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
fKd wrote:
why rename it?

because that filename looks strange. could be the reason why someone might not click on the thread.
Author:  fKd [ 03-27-2010 11:15 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
meh
Author:  cityy [ 03-28-2010 02:39 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
It is looking so damn awesome :tear:

Some things I noticed:

- that railgun "deadend" massively breaks the flow, thought I don't really know how to fix it..
- 1 rocketlauncher might not be a good idea, if 1 team controles mid the other team has no other strong mid/close-range weapons than the LG
- bots don't like the RA area

I think the layout is pretty solid - I had fun playing the map.

Oh and:

Code:
{
map      "q3ctfp13"
longname   "no name yet"
bots      "xaero keel uriel visor"
type      "ctf"
}


You lazy ***** :olo:
Author:  fKd [ 03-28-2010 03:09 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
you can jump though the bars at the rail gun.

heh yeah forgot the .arena file... oops :D
Author:  cityy [ 03-28-2010 03:29 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Yea I know you can do that - you can also rocket jump up there(easiest way to cap on the map) but still.. I really don't know.

You could at least remove the upper bar, it is getting on my nerves :D
Author:  ShadoW_86 [ 03-28-2010 10:14 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Looking very nice, have to dl it :).
Author:  Anthem [ 03-30-2010 02:56 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
You seem to like making very small and cramped maps. The detail is great, the layout is good, but I enjoy larger halls. Definitely a 2v2 map. However, most ctf games should be 3v3-4v4.
Author:  monaster [ 03-30-2010 03:30 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Will post a short review soon with screenshots where I found minor mistakes or have proposals, nothing big though. Map's great as always fKd!

Something else just having read Anthem's sig: Godfuck, you're in EventHorizon!?? :ducky: (Just saw the team trick jumping vids a few minutes ago)
Author:  Anthem [ 03-30-2010 10:14 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
monaster wrote:
Will post a short review soon with screenshots where I found minor mistakes or have proposals, nothing big though. Map's great as always fKd!

Something else just having read Anthem's sig: Godfuck, you're in EventHorizon!?? :ducky: (Just saw the team trick jumping vids a few minutes ago)


Lol, yes. :) You saw all 3 trick jumping vids? The fourth will be coming eventually... :)

Also, to fKd: I reread what I typed earlier, sorry for sounding a bit harsh. Your map really does look very nice. The detailing is great and I really like how you structured several aspects of the map.
Author:  Theftbot [ 03-30-2010 10:29 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
I dont see a name taken in lvl:
"hardquore"
Author:  Hipshot [ 03-31-2010 04:39 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Fkd, I really think you should spend more time with textures. I mean, there's a lot of polygon details, but they look more or less gray and untextured. You could bring out a lot more detail from some smart texturing...
Author:  fKd [ 03-31-2010 05:10 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
yup, was talkin to pat howard and i fully agree, from now with this map, its gonna be less poly detail and more texture work... problem here being i think i need to make my own textures... phase 2, learn how to make textures and write good shaders.... but as it is, this is just me laying out a floor plan and playing around.

cheers hip, my respect for you and ya work is very high and i appreciate the fact you even had a look...

on a side note. eta on ya amazing base textured map? it looks amazing!
Author:  cityy [ 03-31-2010 05:51 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Share your process with us fkd - I am interested in what you are doing! (I still suck at creating textures. :toothy: )
Author:  Hipshot [ 03-31-2010 05:56 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
If you wanna go for a level with this kind of detail, I think you at least needs to be consistent about it. Now you have textured the floor and the sky with detailed texture maps. Also, the light could be improved a lot, since it's so visible when so many areas are gray. You really see all the "errors" in the lightmap since it's so low res.

Gameplay vise, I can't give you any fair judgment - since I only played with bots - and they suck balls for evaluation of a level, espec CTF. But I liked running with the flag back and forth, could prove to be fun when there's a real defense/offense playing.

However, I still think you need to go over clipping and places where the player movement gets obstructed or mis-directed by strange slopes, I can see why it's a problem when having all this detail, when it comes down to that.

I would love to see a less brush detailed level from you with more texture work, it would be like a break from your regular style, clearly.

(The eta on that level is "I don't know", I think I'm gonna release a level in between actually, like sock did with Focal =))
Author:  dONKEY [ 03-31-2010 06:10 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
I thought from the screen shots I was going to be disagreeing with Hipshot about the texturing vs detail. But I'm not. I like the level of brush modelling, but it does need better texture detail and lighting. I wonder, seeing as you 'thought' about working with the U3 engine if you couldn't actually model a lot of these details. Would be good practice. I was surprised on the scale. I thought it would be bigger (said the actress to the Bishop). Not sure what 'real' players will say. Felt a little tight. I love the detail and the look of this thing. It ran well on my machine, over 500 fps everywhere, that said you have r_speeds of 10 to 20k everywhere and even 40k in one spot. Vis blocking needs work for people with older systems. There is a ton of over draw going onto. A lot of stuff overlapped or partially buried that is all adding to tris count.
Good job thus far!
Author:  fKd [ 04-06-2010 03:22 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
nothing has been edited in this shot. lol i died btw...



rocket, meet face :D

current wip shot:



and the build: http://www.filefront.com/16043421/undefined

awww yeah, also... i play in fov 110. just so yas know... i think it looks better heh
Author:  Pat Howard [ 04-07-2010 11:47 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
fKd wrote:
and the build: http://www.filefront.com/16043421/undefined


I don't see anything that has been changed in either the WIP screenshot or the new link. Did you upload the right version?
Author:  fKd [ 04-08-2010 08:17 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
yup, its quite subtle... but there is new layering of textures etc and a bit of detail refinement... maybe only i notice this silly crap lol
anyway newer version coming in soon. been working a bit on the overall theme of the map... im going for a kinda cartoonish sci-fi look... realism be damned! muhahahaha :D

might even get a better clipping pass going, god i get bored of clipping... i know, i know... its important... :/

lol

ill do comparison screenshots of current wip:












ta daaaa :D
Author:  fKd [ 04-08-2010 08:37 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
oh yeah, replaced red armour with quad set to 3 min respawn time
Author:  ShadoW_86 [ 04-08-2010 10:02 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
Quad on such a small map? :eek: What about game balance?
Author:  Anthem [ 04-09-2010 02:14 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
ShadoW_86 wrote:
Quad on such a small map? :eek: What about game balance?


Yeah, I agree. The map is a tad too tight in spots for quad. The quad person could effectively rape the enemy team of their players, flag, and whatever else they have (i.e. red armor) and time the quad so that he or she gets it every time. If you want a power up for the center I recommend picking something less game breaking such as regeneration or haste. Maybe even something like a medkit wouldn't be too bad, but definitely not personal tele.
Author:  monaster [ 04-11-2010 01:45 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
My promised report, mostly nitpicking and stuff like that, hope it is of any use:

The bots carrying the flag ALWAYS took the lower level to get back to their base, at least when I played.

Maybe you could make the water HP-regenerating (2 to 5 HP per second) since there's so much going on around and especially in the pool - that would be a real temptation. Could also be a stupid idea, too?

Be careful with the jumppads leading from the lower to the mid level (highest level for me is railgun position): if you just step onto them and don't jump to their end near the wall they only catapult you into the trim (I always had to press forward to get onto the higher level floor), bots might run into trouble because of that.

Other stuff: my suggestions and remarks are displayed on the pictures itself, if there's more to say, Iit's written below.

Image
Plus, the pipes coming out of these things are not weaponclipped, looks strange launching a rocket not only through the fence but right to the very wall behind it.

Image

Image

Image

Image
This is the first place to camp.

Image
The second.

Image
Bot clip recommended.

Image
Playerclip recommended since you can jump into that red trail and stand there.

Image
Holy fucking shit, a hell of a game given it's narrow space, but still (or perhaps exactly because of that) a very enjoyable ctf map (yeah, once again forgot to set a capture limit but since it never got boring, who cares!).

Good work.

[EDIT: deleted "don't"]
Author:  fKd [ 04-11-2010 02:10 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
cheers man, very helpful stuff. now back to the editor :D

next edition coming very soon... i might finish this one up quite soon as i've drawn a cool idea up for another ctf. been working on refining the theme and selecting textures, as well as the over all clip pass... so far its going well... ish heh :D

oh yeah, and quad switched back to ra
Author:  fKd [ 04-14-2010 03:12 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
just a few shots:




still working...

on a side note. just got dawn of war 2. very fun game. its like diablo 2 mixed with company of heroes....

must map... heh
Author:  fKd [ 04-14-2010 03:23 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
and a new build: still rough. but play it in 2 v 2 only to get the best games. hope its fun :D

http://www.filefront.com/16119989/undefined
Author:  skinNCNmaster [ 04-14-2010 11:08 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
cityy wrote:
It is looking so damn awesome :tear:

You lazy ***** :olo:



nuff said
Author:  skinNCNmaster [ 04-14-2010 11:13 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
monaster wrote:
Maybe you could make the water HP-regenerating (2 to 5 HP per second) since there's so much going on around and especially in the pool - that would be a real temptation. Could also be a stupid idea, too?


wow ive been gone long.. is that capable of being done?

health from running through water... great idea!
Author:  skinNCNmaster [ 04-16-2010 04:58 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
put the map here for me.. your pm does not include any url and this link above is not holding a map file..

no map file:\
http://www.filefront.com/16119989/undefined
Author:  skinNCNmaster [ 04-16-2010 06:06 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: q3ctfp13 no name yet :D
ok ok im a say my optimization comments here...

1. the grey octagonal floor pads should have the narrow ends clipper tooled, so they become three brush units, a long rectangle with a fin at each end, this restricts the engine to draw the top faces as six triangles, two equal right angles on the big rectangle and two small acutes on the ends. Also, switch your grid to the absolute smallest increment and pull the pads off the floor by one grid space, they will no longer touch the floor and thus not subdivide anything that might intersect with the.

second..
youve got the little lights everywhere, and when you placed them you cut them into the trim work, this is a bad idea, clean that all up and remve them from the trim brushes and place a caulk cube in place for each light, the light texture on the front face, and have that face one of the finest grid units out from the actual wall surface, another t-junction saver...

these two small things will optimize your map quite a lot... tough you have a lot of sloppy stuff to clean up if youre going to get the tri counts down.. i ran around in the map in devmode with r_showtris on and was aghast.. lol

gtk doesent work like it used to.. im fumbling with things that used to be simple.. its odd.. im gonna havta rollback to an older version older than 1.4... lol

other things.. you've use a lot of large pieces of brushwork where much more refined brushes would fit precisely between corners and edges..

for example you have a large floor brush that extends under a wall and into the next room over, it also ends beneath a wall instead of at the walls edge... this type of brushwork is costing you. every time the render has to decide to add another triangle or draws a texture that you cant see anyway... drags eh.. your map is huge.. and youve really got a LOT of cleanup to do
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