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Topic Starter Topic: Just thought I'd point this out to the Firefox people...
rep
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 03:12 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Speciflcally the ones who have given me crap over using Opera, the world's best and most featured internet browser.

http://www.howtocreate.co.uk/browserSpeed.html#winspeed

As you can clearly see, as I've always said, Opera is the best browser on the planet. Here is the conclusion of the tests:

Quote:
So overall, Opera seems to be the fastest browser for windows. Firefox is not faster than Internet Explorer, except for scripting, but for standards support, security and features, it is a better choice. However, it is still not as fast as Opera, and Opera also offers a high level of standards support, security and features.

On Linux, Konqueror is the fastest for starting and viewing basic pages on KDE, but as soon as script or images are involved, or you want to use the back or forward buttons, or if you use Gnome, Opera is a faster choice, even though on KDE it will take a few seconds longer to start. Mozilla and Firefox give an overall good performance, but their script, cache handling and image-based page speed still cannot compare with Opera.


I've gotten shit from people on this forum for using Opera, because it is a pay browser. It's an excellent value, though. Version 7 came out in January 2003, and right now it's in version 7.54. They have new releases with more features every few months, and work on a proper revision release protocol... For example, they don't just go 1.0->1.5->2.0, they release in tenths places, so 7.01, 7.02, 7.03, so we get more stuff for a longer period of time. With that $39 you get free upgrades for the entire duration of the version, so if you buy during 7.0 you get updates all the way up to 7.99. It's been over two years, and they aren't near that point yet.

Right now if you buy 7.54, you get a free upgrade to 8.0 when it comes out, which means you'll get free upgrades to 8.99... 8.99 won't be out until probably the end of 2007, so it's a great value for the fastest on the planet.

Open source starves babies.



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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 03:24 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


:icon10: qwfix
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rep
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 03:28 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Yeah, your post should go straight to qwfix as it serves no purpose.

I see a lot of threads about how much Firefox supposedly owns, so I thought I'd just post some factual information on how Opera completely destroys it in every single way.



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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 03:33 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I'll never pay for a browser and I dont notice any speed issues with FF.
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 03:43 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


True, if there is any difference in speed it's negligable. I tried Opera a few times and I just don't like it. Also, I'm not going to pay for a tiny speed increase. Same as my ISP offering an extra megabit/sec for a higher price. I won't do it because I'm already satisfied with what I have. Sure it would be a little faster but it's not worth having to pay extra for it to me.
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inphlict
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 03:53 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I like firefox more.
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rep
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 04:06 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


The issue was never what people liked or didn't.

I've seen people here claim that Firefox is better. It's not. People are already convinced it's safer and faster than Internet Explorer, and while there are far less exploits for Firefox, they will come in force within the next few years as Firefox gains more popularity at the workplace.

You can like your Ford Focus, and you don't want to pay for the Spyder, but the Spyder still owns it.

Opera is free, by the way. You can pay $39 to get rid of the banner forever, if you wish. There is a small banner at the top right if you're a free user, and it's hardly visible.

A lot of folks who don't like Opera after giving it a spin were turned off by the toolbars, but you can totally customize them to be however you want. There are even downloadable toolbars that people have tweaked to their likings that many people also find to be nice for themselves. Adding to that, Firefox is just an analbaby of Internet Explorer and Opera. They try to make it close enough to Internet Explorer that people don't get confused and lost in the switch, while copying features Opera has used for years such as plugins and tabbed browsing. I think there is even a plugin ripoff for Firefox that emulates Opera's mouse gestures. Mouse gestures are the absolute best and fastest way to browse. Period.



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4g3nt_Smith
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 05:45 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


So, under those specific conditions and on that site's test macinhes, shit browser (AKA Opera) was faster? Sounds good to me, considering FF is noticibly faster on my systems.
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glossy
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PostPosted: 02-11-2005 09:15 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


what we mean by "better" is that for the price it's better than anything else on the market.

if you then enter a different market -- paid-for internet browsers -- then it may be the superior one.

also keep in mind what you're quoting only takes into account speed and base features. i like the feel of FireFox much more than i do the feel of Opera or the original Mozilla, but that's just a personal preference... i'll keep using firefox.
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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 12:32 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


4g3nt_Smith wrote:
So, under those specific conditions and on that site's test macinhes, shit browser (AKA Opera) was faster? Sounds good to me, considering FF is noticibly faster on my systems.


Is there any proof that you have to back FF being "faster" on your system?

:icon6:
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saturn
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 01:15 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


you have totally convinved me rep, i'm gonna ditch FF and switch over to Opera
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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 01:27 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


saturn wrote:
you have totally convinved me rep, i'm gonna ditch FF and switch over to Opera


:icon19:
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Seg
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 01:29 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Who cares if it can render a page a tenth of a second faster? I hate Opera. It has by far the worst interface I have ever had the pleasure of deleteing from my system... :icon26:
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 02:39 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Seg wrote:
Who cares if it can render a page a tenth of a second faster? I hate Opera. It has by far the worst interface I have ever had the pleasure of deleteing from my system... :icon26:


So you're saying you're a moron?

You can make it look however you want... Don't you get it? With mouse gestures, I don't even need to see the interface half of the time. I drag Opera over to the third monitor and go full screen. Mouse gestures let you surf so easily, and everything you need is in the right click menu.



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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 04:49 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


i hate to actually aggree with rep on something...
but, i've been using opera for years now... (yes i paid for a browser).
but since ~75% of the time i spend on my pc is using the net. i've probably paid them < $0.000001 / hour of useage. the money is not a reason to knock the program.
firefox is cute... but the only way i could ever use it would be to hack it to look and feel like opera... which admittadly is probalby easier now that FF has stolen most of the good ideas opera had.
+ yeah... FF is slower... and i do notice it.

but it all comes down to personal preference...
to each his own. :shrug:
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 05:03 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


IE 6 works fine for me :shrug:



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saturn
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 05:43 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


actually, i just downloaded opera to try it out for a while.
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4g3nt_Smith
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 07:53 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Tormentius wrote:
4g3nt_Smith wrote:
So, under those specific conditions and on that site's test macinhes, shit browser (AKA Opera) was faster? Sounds good to me, considering FF is noticibly faster on my systems.


Is there any proof that you have to back FF being "faster" on your system?

:icon6:


Sure, hold on whilst I make some BS site with lots of graphs, charts, tables, and big words.
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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 10:19 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


4g3nt_Smith wrote:
Tormentius wrote:
4g3nt_Smith wrote:
So, under those specific conditions and on that site's test macinhes, shit browser (AKA Opera) was faster? Sounds good to me, considering FF is noticibly faster on my systems.


Is there any proof that you have to back FF being "faster" on your system?

:icon6:


Sure, hold on whilst I make some BS site with lots of graphs, charts, tables, and big words.


Or you could actually back your claims for once. Novel thought eh?
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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 10:21 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


boo wrote:
IE 6 works fine for me :shrug:


Likewise. Easily patched to many clients, more than enough features, already builtin, and stable.




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Seg
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 12:46 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


rep wrote:
So you're saying you're a moron?

You can make it look however you want... Don't you get it? With mouse gestures, I don't even need to see the interface half of the time. I drag Opera over to the third monitor and go full screen. Mouse gestures let you surf so easily, and everything you need is in the right click menu.


No I think you don't get it. I'm not the one telling people what fucking browser they should or should not be using.

I have installed and tried Opera on both Windows and Linux. Just the fact that it's adware is annoying enough for deletion. I found the interface to be bulky and somewhat kludged. On Linux it would randomly crash every 4-5 minutes. I tried it and I did not like it. That's my opinion, deal with it.
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rep
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 01:28 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Oh no! Adware!

Everything must be free in this mindfuck age of open source garbage!

Teenagers with free time on their hands because they're losers sit at home and learn to program with their warezed Visual C++ and Delphi programs, and become a part of some project which has one purpose... Do something someone else has already done for free. It doesn't matter if our product is better or worse, it only matters that it's free! This way, we'll really stick it to those billionaire programmers at Microsoft who paid to go to college and worked their way up through other companies for years just to get to Microsoft and be able to code IE7! We'll make this program and get all of our IRC and forum nerds to spread the word about how much better it is than the eViLeMpIrE's program, when really it's not.

Then, when the programmers are all laid off because we did this shit for free, WE'LL BE HIRED by companies like google, and they'll be at home figuring out if they can make two cans of creamed corn into a dinner for the family!



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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 02:15 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Verging on a QWFix move. Keep it to relevant points rather than rants gents.
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4g3nt_Smith
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 02:17 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


To Tormentius, shall I write out a detailed comparison of how every time I have tried Opera, it's considerably slower to start, render pages, and even accept fucking user input? Are you really such an ass that you have to have proof that a browser runs better on a certain system?

Bakc on topic, I see that even after the transistion from raw-one to Q3W, rep is still a cunt. You seem to be very pissed at people who like to write a piece of software for free; I assume you get paid to write medicore programs which cost money, but for which there is a free (and most likely superior) alterantive.
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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 02:19 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


4g3nt_Smith wrote:
To Tormentius, shall I write out a detailed comparison of how every time I have tried Opera, it's considerably slower to start, render pages, and even accept fucking user input? Are you really such an ass that you have to have proof that a browser runs better on a certain system?

Bakc on topic, I see that even after the transistion from raw-one to Q3W, rep is still a cunt. You seem to be very pissed at people who like to write a piece of software for free; I assume you get paid to write medicore programs which cost money, but for which there is a free (and most likely superior) alterantive.


Read my post above. I'm not trying to prove one way or the other. You made a claim and I asked if you had proof of that claim. If this is simply a case of "I like FF better because it suits my needs more" then I can respect that.




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prince1000
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 02:27 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Tormentius wrote:
Verging on a QWFix move. Keep it to relevant points rather than rants gents.


don't you mean R&R?
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Tormentius
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 02:34 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


prince1000 wrote:
don't you mean R&R?


Meh, if rep keeps it up you're right. Browser wars never end well.
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 04:33 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Agent Smith, please post some sort of backing to your claims, and a description of your system and I'll e-mail support about whatever quirk in your system setup is causing anomalous problems sole to your system, apparently.

The site you've criticized was completely unbiased in their report, and it was on slashdot, a community that attracts open source advocates who have yet to find anything to refute the commonly known fact that Opera is a better and faster browser.

To seg, and anyone else who is interested in Opera: Does this look cluttered to you?

Image

It's totally functional, and you can do whatever you like with the program. It's quite easy to do so, also. Just right click any toolbar and select customize toolbars'.

For a quick start with mouse gestures, all mouse gestures are executed through either the right mouse button or the middle mouse button or any number of customizable variations that you can come up with. If you want, you can go as far as creating a mouse gesture that when you write your name in cursive with the mouse it enters your password.

Most are far simpler than that, however. You hold the button down, move the mouse, and then let go to execute a gesture. I'll be using >V^< to indicate mouse direction. RMB+< = go back a page. RMB+^V = reload. MMB on a link = open in new tab. RMB+(Shape of an L) = Close the current tab. RMB+(Backwards L shape) = go to the previous tab. RMB+V = make a new tab. RMB+Mousewheel = select a tab.

It really changes how you use the internet. It speeds everything up so much with browsing that you're going so fast that you totally forget that the browser itself is faster at loading everything anyway. :)



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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 08:56 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


rep wrote:

It really changes how you use the internet. It speeds everything up so much with browsing that you're going so fast that you totally forget that the browser itself is faster at loading everything anyway. :)


i'm adding this to my wtf list.
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 09:02 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I just use IE because it works and it displays stuff the way I am used to seeing it, and it hasn't been a spyware or trojan problem for me :icon14:
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prince1000
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PostPosted: 02-12-2005 09:31 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


i hadn't used opera since v4 but i'm kind of digging this. i need to mess with the email client a bit more. i may be sold on it.
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rep
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PostPosted: 02-13-2005 02:38 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Since e-mail is totally useless in the 21st century (Until the New World Order forces everyone to use some completely secure and un-crackable form of biometrics to verify a public key, and they get e-cops to crack down on spammers) I just use it for it's RSS feeds. :)



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PostPosted: 02-13-2005 12:58 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I don't need a browser to make surfing extremely fast. I don't mind moving my mouse a bit to click on something. Matter of fact I have the mouse gestures extension for FF and haven't even used it. Just to satisfy you rep, I'll dl Opera again and tweak it up and give it another shot. I'll bet $10 that I end up deleting it agian though. Oh and IE is free too, so that kindof negates the argument of open source vs. IE.

edit: Well, so far I'm not exactly impressed. Yeah it's pretty customisable. But 'on my system' it seems a bit slower then FF. Other than that not really any different or better. Sorry, but no sale here.
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4g3nt_Smith
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PostPosted: 02-13-2005 03:42 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Its all about subjective e-penis for some people. :icon26:
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PostPosted: 02-13-2005 04:28 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Kaziganthe wrote:
I don't notice any speed difference from IE, to FF, to Opera in page load times, or program startup times. Except IE is a little faster to start, considering it's integrated into the OS and all. I use FF for the tabs, but I have little problem with either of the three browsers. Besides, what does two seconds of extra load time matter?


:paranoid:


That's exactly my point. I couldn't care less if it loads a second or two faster. Don't get me wrong, Opera is ok. A pretty good browser. I'm just vehemently against ads and I'm not going to pay to have them removed when I can get esentially the same features for free. And before rep starts with the open source vs. big company again, IE is free and comes with windows. When you pay for the OS you pay the people that developed IE. A free browser in no way detracts from that.
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