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Topic Starter Topic: Finally picked up ETQW...

foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 02:03 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


...and I fucking love it.

Definitely a steep learning curve, and that's probably what put me off games like Wolf:ET and BF before.
I have found this site for noobs useful.
But just mapping the sheer number of controls alone is an art in itself, which I'm still refining.

I've been practicing offline, learning the various classes, vehicles etc.
Everything feels well balanced and thought out, although being on the offensive has the advantage.
I mean, making something happen is easier than making something *not* happen, especially with such generous timeframes.
I think I still prefer being on defense, though. Nothing beats softening up a Cyclops with some mines and then have an AVT you just deployed finish the job.

The engine must really like my computer.
It consistently draws 60fps+ with 1920x1200, everything high/ultra and 4xAA, just dipping a little during very intense scenes.
I used this tweak guide to learn some CVARS.
Most noticably r_useThreadedRenderer "2" to get the most out of my Q6600.
I'm kind of suprised this was only included in the 1.2 patch, seeing this is such a processor intensive engine with all the shit going on.

I still suck at flying the air vehicles (whether advanced flight controls are disabled or not) so I need to work on that some more.
Also finding suitable terrain for deployment can be a hassle; Starting at my team's territory border and searching back to find the first green spot isn't the way to go, but I'll probably just have to learn the maps some more.
What also can be awkward is selecting an object to interact with; I sometimes have to spaz around the object until the hand-icon appears.


Anyways, glad I picked it up, gonna practice some more offline, and will probably go online this weekend.




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Rationalis
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 07:06 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It really is the shit. A few suggestions for the offline experimentation stuff:

1. Try each class for the entirety of each campaign for both sides...this will help you learn the class specific features of each stage of each map.

2. Bump up the bot buddies to at least 10 per side (which you'll have to do from the console) and set the bots to expert. Decide on a campaign, join the game, add yourself as an "admin" from the limbo screen (the screen where you choose your class), then go back to the game, wait for all of the 16 bots to join the game then hit the tilde key and type:

si_maxplayers 20 (or 22 or 24)

bot_minclients -1

then you can add more bots per side (up to the limit you set above) by typing:

admin addbot gdf (or strogg)

then end the 'warmup' phase and start the game.

This is important since most decent games you'll find online are going to be 10+ players per side and the maps play very differently with fewer players.

Also pm obsidian to add you to the clan.



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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 08:36 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Plan B wrote:
Nothing beats softening up a Cyclops with some mines and then have an AVT you just deployed finish the job.


I don't think that's going to work against real players, they just shoot the mines to blow them up before walking through them. Mines are best used hidden around corners to take out personnel when they run past. Also, right-click on a vertical surface in a hallway when dropping a mine will create a trip mine. You can strafe-jump past most prox-mines taking just a bit of damage. Trip mines have an obvious laser beam, but they go off automatically so strafe-jumping doesn't work. So drop a trip mine around the corner of a corridor, someone rushing around the corner in the corridor won't see the laser beam and they'll trip it.

Advanced flight controls are a must. Can't actually shoot anything with it disabled since it prevents you from pitching your nose too far down making ground targets hard to hit. The air vehicles work like a helicopter, pitching the nose forward moves it forward. Make sure you play with back-thrust, hovering and many manoeuvres are done this way. Flying is really an art and not that many people are good at it. I can survive maybe about a minute in one before getting shot down, GONNAFISTYA's probably the best Q3W pilot so maybe he'll have a few tips and configs to share.

When you get online, PM me (0bsidian with a ZERO) and I'll add you to the clan. You may want to get in contact with some of the European members and get them to play more. The Q3W regulars seem to be mostly North Americans. Ping times across the Atlantic are about 130's but it's still quite playable.



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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 09:01 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Hannibal wrote:
Try each class for the entirety of each campaign for both sides...this will help you learn the class specific features of each stage of each map.


Yarrr...that adds up to 10 classes x 12 maps x ~15 mins = 30 hours.
Wow, bit much just for prepping, nevertheless seems realistic.
Think I played for about 15 hours, mainly soldr/aggr, engineer/constr and field ops/opprsr, though.
Still have some of that that instant gratification, selfserving noobness, I suppose ;)


Thanks for the SP tweaks. I've been using the default settings but I'm sure that doesn't optimally prepare you for MP.


Hannibal wrote:
Also pm obsidian to add you to the clan.


What, no hazing?

Yeah, I read about team homo, is it?
Would be sweet so chalk me up as 1 more from Yerp : pompoms :




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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 09:18 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
mine stuff


Good info.
Of course, playing against bots spoils you in that respect.
A bot driving a Cyclops or walking through hallways *will* trip mines. Needs some AI tweakage.


obsidian wrote:
flight stuff


Yeah, at this point I find myself avoiding flight altogether (apart from the Icarus, of course), and that strategy will not fare well in a MP environment.


obsidian wrote:
clan stuff


Cool, will do.
And I'm more concerned with the time zone difference than the connectivity.
Ah well...back into nocturnal mode.




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Rationalis
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 09:58 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Oops, I should've been more clear. You don't have to do the prep across all campaigns for classes like soldiers, medics...their roles are pretty straightforward on virtually every map. I would suggest however that if Field Ops/Opressor and Covert Ops/Infiltrators appeal to you, play each campaign all the way through with each of them---even on maps where another class is primary (your bot buddies can complete the objectives). It will be invaluable to you later online if want to contribute meaningfully to your team (especially in maps where their roles are decidedly secondary)...you'll have a better sense of what support activities can aid the main effort (i.e., completing objectives).


Also, make sure you choose "custom" for bot skill on the main "play computer" screen....this will open up a set of options...then be sure to select "Friendly Fire". I have no idea why the offline mode does not use this as default because it is always on in online matches. After doing this, follow the other offline stuff I posted above.

vehicles: I decided awhile ago that if it flys, I either avoid the fucker or shoot it down. I can't pilot for shit and refuse to learn. :mad:



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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 10:41 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Covert ops/infiltrators, but particularly medic/tech have this subservient, unappealing aura about them, but I understand their significance in MP.
Still think that playing as medic/tech is the least fulfilling role, though.




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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 11:05 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Looks like we're complete opposites. I won't play covert or field ops unless for objectives or if we REALLY need one and no one else is willing to go.

I love being medic. I basically never die (duck around corners and toss myself health packs/stroyent) and never run out of ammo (drop a supply crate/stroyent). Infinite grenades from a crate are awesome for taking down strong points or to choke a bottleneck. Nothing is more satisfying than running into a room right after the Strogg massacred your team and strafe-jump-crouch revive everyone until everyone is back up again, all before the Strogg realize what's going on. As a technician, your spawnhosts will always keep you on the front line even if you get shot down.

BTW, as Strogg, make sure you bind a key to stroy up and down, you can convert health to ammo and vice-versa.



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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 11:48 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
Nothing is more satisfying than running into a room right after the Strogg massacred your team and strafe-jump-crouch revive everyone until everyone is back up again, all before the Strogg realize what's going on.


Hehe, yeah, I get that, the game has that fluidity to it.
I like how moments like that come together, also in other classes.

Strogg health<=>ammo-exchange is indeed a nice ability.
I find that I usually forget about using it, though.




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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 04:37 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
Advanced flight controls are a must. Can't actually shoot anything with it disabled since it prevents you from pitching your nose too far down making ground targets hard to hit. The air vehicles work like a helicopter, pitching the nose forward moves it forward. Make sure you play with back-thrust, hovering and many manoeuvres are done this way.


Actually...I play with the advanced flight controls off and have for a while. :shrug:

I've tried them both and I still prefer the default setting of having it disabled.

The advanced flight controls turned on gives you more range for rotations of pitching the nose straight up or down at targets (or even continuing in the roll to fire behind you) and doing barrel rolls to escape a lock....but that's only good when you have lots of room to make mistakes. The way I fly and fight I'm "down in the shit" alot which means I'm buzzing low between buildings and trees at top speed with not much room to spare. Also, because I often move laterally while attacking a ground target I find having the advanced controls off allows me to be a little more aggressive with my attacks (which is more of a thrill anyways) and allows me to catch myself sometimes instead of rolling over uncontrollably and crashing into the ground more than I want to. This - obviously - allows me to stay in the fight much longer.

With advanced flight controls off I can get right in your face, do an attack that scares the shit out of the opposing team and somehow still survive with enough control to fly under the bridge or between the trees (instead of crashing into them) to escape a missile lock. With the tight quarters, there's no way to fly that way with advanced controls turned on without eyes in the back of your head...you're always making flight corrections instead of focusing on killing the enemy. Alot of pilots avoid that mess by hovering far away and bombing targets out of enemy attack range...but advanced controls aren't an advantage for that. I also don't see turning it off as a hindrance in a dogfight with a really skilled opponent...if you can aim quickly and force your opponent into a defensive or evasive posture advanced controls won't make much of a difference. I'll admit that the longer a dogfight lasts the more I wish I used advanced controls but most fights are over pretty quickly. There have been times when an opponent made a move that was out of my rotation range (like going directly below me) but that doesn't mean you can't make a quick move to reacquire the target.

In general, use the advanced flight controls if - while pounding on a Cyclops or Titan tank and everyone is shooting rockets at you - you're good at recognizing and recovering from uncontrolled rolls ....and you're at least 150 metres above the ground.

obsidian wrote:
Flying is really an art and not that many people are good at it. I can survive maybe about a minute in one before getting shot down, GONNAFISTYA's probably the best Q3W pilot so maybe he'll have a few tips and configs to share.


:ninja:

I put a few ideas in the Tips and Tricks thread.

And against a good, dug in defense with lots of rocket soldiers and AVTs...I also usually don't last a minute. During those times when the team can't punch a hole I'll sometimes kamikaze into turrets or tanks (firing rockets all the way). Do as much damage as you can, respawn and continue scaring the shit out of them until their defenses crack and they run for cover. :p




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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 07:55 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


GONNAFISTYA wrote:
Flying stuff


NO FREAKING WAY! I can't believe you've been owning with advanced flight controls off. I've seen you do what looks like some pretty tight circle strafing turns in the Anansi and always wondered how you pulled it off without crashing into things. I'll have to try your "in your face" tactic and see how that works. I'll probably just get myself killed faster.



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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 08:59 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Getting close gives you a higher chance of getting fragged and you'll definately die more often if you decide to hang around too long, but the psychological effects you can bring to a battle are very apparent. Eventually they'll fear you enough to just avoid you and it's at that point that you can herd them like cattle.

I've seen opposing teams move relatively unhindered towards the objective if I bomb them from high up and out of sight...they charge to the objective and hope I don't get them. But if you fly down low right in front of them with a quick barrage of rockets and a quick blast of the lower machine gun to cut down the survivors and hovering menacingly as they wait to respawn....well...they tend to change tactics in their advance after that. :smirk:

Attack from close to let them know you're in the fight, attack them from far when it's tactically your only option but always keep them guessing and weary of the sky.




Last edited by GONNAFISTYA on 08-07-2008 09:02 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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I'm the dude!
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 09:01 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Wait... how do you shoot the lower machine gun? I thought only the passenger could do that.



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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 08-07-2008 09:07 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Switch seats. I rarely have passengers but I prefer having a gunner at all times. Whenever I have one I offer the gunner kills by hovering above on-foot targets instead of me pointing the nose down and taking targets away from them...I'm hunting bigger fish. So with no gunner it's the same as taking the gunner position in the Hog when parked (obviously). The vehicle will "float" for a second or two before starting to descend...giving you a couple of seconds to aim and blast them before switching back to pilot and starting the engines again.

For a prolonged "gunner seat" session aim the nose up in a hover before switching...your gun is already aimed in that direction when you switch (it also gives you a wider range of attack) and you'll fly backwards and drop slowly but you'll be retreating from the target so you can keep the target in view - instead of flying over it and having to twist your aim - to shoot for about 3 to 5 seconds (doing mucho damage) before flying it out of trouble with a blast of forward boost because the nose is still pointing up when you take the pilot's seat. :up:

Also...if your opponent in a dogfight is on fire (severely damaged) show him your belly (for the above mentioned reason), switch to the gunner and finish him off. It's easier than lining him up with a rocket or getting a lock...especially if he/she is a slippery cunt. Your opponents rarely anticipate it.




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Trainee
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PostPosted: 08-08-2008 04:11 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
Nothing is more satisfying than running into a room right after the Strogg massacred your team and strafe-jump-crouch revive everyone until everyone is back up again, all before the Strogg realize what's going on.


And nothing is more irritating than seeing a medic heal an entire room of troops you've just given the hyperblaster treatment :(

Hannibal wrote:
I can't pilot for shit and refuse to learn.


It's amazingly easy really, at least if you have played Battlefield 2 where flying is harder but also made so that if you can fly there's nothing anyone can do about it. That's why BF2 is unplayable these days. Vehicles in ETQW are less capable of total domination although the Strogg clearly have an advantage over the GDF.

It's irritating when you have tons of Field Ops or Covert Ops in your team but they are incapable of inflicting damage on turrets & artilleries. That's why you need to learn how to pilot so that you can take down evey single enemy structure within a minute.



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PostPosted: 08-09-2008 07:35 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I wouldn't say the Strogg have any sort of advantage over the GDF, it all depends on the players. Case in point, rambo GDF medics reviving everyone you just shot down. :p

A lot of noob players feel as if they HAVE to be on GDF, so that sometimes ends up being where the GDF are disadvantaged.



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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-09-2008 08:54 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
I wouldn't say the Strogg have any sort of advantage over the GDF...


Convert stroyent, fly Icariii, create forcefields, throw sticky grenades, hog-ram.


Thanks for the flight info, GFY. Been trying, but I won't be the 'designated flyer' any time soon.
I just have too much trouble staying airborne, let alone be useful by destroying targets.




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Trainee
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PostPosted: 08-09-2008 09:35 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


obsidian wrote:
I wouldn't say the Strogg have any sort of advantage over the GDF, it all depends on the players.


Well it was a ceteris paribus assumption of coure.

Plan B wrote:
Convert stroyent, fly Icariii, create forcefields, throw sticky grenades, hog-ram.


Cyclops, spawn hosts (although this is compensated by faster GDF revives), hyperblaster, flyer drones...



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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 08-09-2008 12:33 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


...and personal teleporters.

I really love the Cyclops' ability to stomp its feet for those close up kills. (press Spacebar)




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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 08-09-2008 12:37 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Dunno...the game is pretty balanced. Little differences here and there can be exploited or ignored. Like obsidian said...it's the players that make the difference with the available tools.

Also the GDF have vehicles that can use the water.




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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-14-2008 05:27 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Just went online for the first time, had to sort out some router issues first.
I joined a game that only had a couple of minutes to go and sucked to high heaven, but picked up my first 122 XPs, baby.
Pretty frantic stuff, played as Strogg constructor and GDF had already constructed the EMP Disruptor, but we held the fort.
Makes me wonder if the team on offense really has the advantage, like I assumed from practicing with bots. Any statistics on that?




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Trainee
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PostPosted: 08-15-2008 12:57 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Plan B wrote:
Makes me wonder if the team on offense really has the advantage, like I assumed from practicing with bots.


Based on my experience:
-North America 1: defense wins (clearly)
-North America 2: offense wins
-North America 3: defense wins
-Pacific 1: offense wins
-Pacific 2: defense wins (clearly)
-Pacific 3: offense wins
-Africa 1: offense wins
-Africa 2: defense wins
-Africa 3: offense wins
-Europe 1: offense wins (clearly)
-Europe 2: defense wins
-Europe 3: defense wins

So it's fifty-fifty.



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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-16-2008 05:49 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Yeah, the official stat site shows GDF-wins:414,272/Strogg-wins:555,120, so it's also pretty well balanced in that department.
I'm impressed. I mean the game has all this asymmetry on various levels, yet it all seems to even out.




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Trainee
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PostPosted: 08-16-2008 06:13 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Well, a lead of 140 000 is still quite noticeable.



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foolproof
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PostPosted: 08-18-2008 03:34 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Yeah, 43%/57%.

So maybe that can be ascribed to the Strogg advantages discussed earlier.
Or people play more for Strogg because they *think* there are advantages, and shift the win-balance.
But that may sound a bit desperate (must.defend.game!)




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Trainee
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PostPosted: 08-18-2008 12:19 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Actually it's the GDF team that's always full and you have like ten observers waiting for a spot. But what obsidian said earlier about n00bs joining the GDF could be true.



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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 08-18-2008 01:51 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


From what I've found during the start of a new campaign is that EVERYONE is waiting to join GDF instead of pressing "Auto Join".

Then the match starts with all of eight players before everyone else finally bites the bullet and joins Strogg (with a few lamers FINALLY getting a chance to join GDF to even the teams out).

I've NEVER seen the opposite (of people waiting to join Strogg first).

I've noticed this because I've often waited to join GDF if my clan mates are on that side or if I want to play a specific class on GDF (I prefer the sniper rifle over the rail and the Anansi over the Tormentor).




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PostPosted: 04-08-2009 09:37 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


as a noob with a degree of patience that's typical of most fps players (i.e.: none whatsoever), i think a small part of the gdf preference thing is the style and naming of classes and weapons for the strogg.

the first time i played (against the computer) it gave me something called a 'lacerator' that looked like one of GWAR's stage dildos. what the fuck is a lacerator? is it a machine gun, a rifle, an ashtray launcher? none of the strogg weapons really tell you what they do by looking at them and they all look more or less the same. until i've played it a few more times, i'll have to refer to a rough mental checklist for some of the strogg weapons:

lacerator = assault rifle
obliterator = rocket launcher
lightning pistol = machine pistol
hyperblaster = heavy machine gun
nailgun = shotgun
plasma launcher = grenade launcher
railgun = sniper rifle
accurised lacerator = scoped assault rifle
sharp grenade = grenade/sticky bomb (gdf have girl throw on alt-fire)
scrambler grenade = emp grenade

the strogg voices are annoying as well, they sound like a bunch of spotty heavy metal fans trying to call up a demon to vanquish a bully. can imagine other noobs having the same irritation. once you get over that first impression then it's all good and team appearance/sounds are irrelevant as long as you can recognise them, but it's quite a strong first impression.




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Glayven?
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PostPosted: 04-08-2009 01:17 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Actually the name "Lacerator" would make more sense if it was an ashtray launcher.... flying disks slicing and dicing the enemy up...leaving lacerations and a horrible shaving cut.

Or perhaps the context of "lacerator" or "oblitorator" is the same as "humiliator" in that it's descriptive in terms of psychological effects it brings to no0b GDF fagg0ts?

Or perhaps I'm high.



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Rationalis
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PostPosted: 04-08-2009 07:35 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Personally, I find the strogg voice chat stuff far more entertaining. The milktoast GDF gay sarcasm grates...but I could (even now) listen to "Kill the Human food" and the other funny strogg taunts all the live long day.


btw, I much prefer the lacerator to the AR (and strogg in general)...much easier for me to track and hit targets (though the AR has the advantage at shorter ranges). However, the scoped AR is a different story entirely...much better handling and aiming than the scoped lacerator at least for me.

The plasma launcher is the best all around weapon in the game...no contest.

I've only been playing sporadically over the last few months but plan on playing a lot more in the coming weeks.



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