Quake3World

run it through a warehouse map :A and dont cap it.
curious to see how it runs

You do know what this is, dont you?

I could be running the game at 1 fps my end yet i could make you watch a movie thats 999 fps.

I control the frame rate of the MOVIE, it doesn't get a say what it is. I capped the "movie" at 15FPS, because thats all you need to see things in motion. If I was to cap it at 30FPS, then it would be twice as large, if i was to cap it at 60, 4x as large etc etc

So, making a movie shows nobody the frame rate, because i control what the frame rate is

BTw, the warehouse map is the hardest map we have to do because not only do i need to place lights BY HAND next to every light texture, but i also need to script the lights to turn on/off and include different light styles. Thats not working right as yet, so we cant do that.

As for FPS, its great, for me at least. I get about 60 FPS average in doom 3, and in Q2E i get about 120 average. Both, are because its capped at that level.

The problem is with lights intersecting each other. Any light that crosses paths with another light has a big FPS drop. This is the same n any PPL engine, it cant be fixed. And in Quake 2, there are areas with 50 lights just next to each other for no reason, then a few yards away pitch black areas. So its very hard to get areas looking "good" but "fast" too, so we are having to mess about quite a lot.

We could just do it the tenebrae way, and have every ambient light be a ppl light, thus having shadows that go everywhere and fps in the teens, but we dont want that.

i know you capped the movie.
dont that is, make it run at 30fps

and about the warehouse map.. that sucks. give us another map then.

The problem is with lights intersecting each other. Any light that crosses paths with another light has a big FPS drop. This is the same n any PPL engine, it cant be fixed.

i guess thats another reason not to use PPL then or no wait, thats another sign of id not doing things the most efficient way

MKJ wrote:i guess thats another reason not to use PPL then or no wait, thats another sign of id not doing things the most efficient way

I realise it's not a serious comment but in Doom 3's case it is the most efficient way of what can be done with a GeForce 3

Its not bad, but when you look at the difference between two light volumes and then two light volumes that intersect each other, the difference in frame rate becomes obvious.

However, the great thing about Per Pixel Lighting and Shadowing is that it can STILL look good, even with smaller radius on point lights. And, if you think about it, if a light is so big it will intersect with another light, the effect probably wont look very good at all, much to bright in fact.

The problem with Quake 2 is two fold, as i've said beffore; There are areas where there are a lot of light brushes next to each other. For these, we will have to either a) light each one of these with an actual light and risk the drop in FPS or b) plant "ambient lights" on each one of these, and only one or two with actual point lights, so that they light up everything as it would be, but dont cause a big FPS drop (This can look bad, as ambient lighting doesn't do anything other than light stuff up. It wont change normal maps or specular maps, wont even cast shadows).

THEN, there is the problem of areas with NO LIGHTS at all. These can be VERY hard to work out. I've come up with a way of lighting these areas in a Quake 2 style, even with no original light source in the map. I simply model a light that looks like a vanilla Quake 2 light brush, and script its origin in the area i would like a visible light source. Then, i script the light itself into this location, and it will look correct in game.

Both methods have hacky ways t ofix things but CAN be done.

Its all because Quake 2 was never supposed to be per pixel lit in the first place... Bummer... But we do try to get around silly situations

Tr3B's also working on a Q2 source mod that you might be interested in. He's using deluxel mapping. Not sure if you guys are interested in combining your efforts... (hint, hint).

http://www.splashdamage.com/index.php?n ... c&p=113783

Treb is working on something different. hes using Qrazor FX, a mod that wont play Quake 2 stuff any more, doesn't have much to do with q2 other than it being based on quake 2 source. It loads doom 3 assets like maps and models.

Plus deluxe maps are behind us in terms of tech. Deluxe maps are precompiled to have certain angles. They look good, are fast, but are static. It als olacks proper per pixel shadow volumes, which we have already.

Its not really compatible with Q2E, and its a step backward for us.