Quake3World

raw wrote:

seremtan wrote:can someone give me a quick explanation of this whole voting rights kerfuffle? can't everyone just vote right now? what's the story?

Not sure if it's quick to explain. However, voting isn't a right given at birth or citizenship and there are a lot of games being played to prevent folks from voting like long lines, criminalizing giving folks food/drink while in long lines, voter-id (sort of a poll tax), gerrymandered maps, ...etc.

As citizen of the U.S. you have the exclusive right to vote:
https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/
Fourteenth Amendment
Section 2
"...and citizens of the United States,..."

We just need one valid ID for each vote of US citizen 18 years of age or older, born or naturalized in the U.S., who has residency(50 day min.) of the single state voting from who is alive and on own free will wanting to vote(BOTH in person or absentee).

That's a broad stroke that doesn't even begin to cover the issue. Example: A state ID costs money, money that some people do not have. Typically, a utility bill or other form of identification (without a cost) is used to prevent an unintended (and illegal) poll tax.

My point is that while we have the "right", the fact that we have to enroll into something that should be automatically enrolled. The system is used to suppress votes.

TLMUFDVR wrote:

"register to vote" =/= "vote". some of those countries only require id to register; others will require it to both register *and* vote. as i understand it, the move in the US is to demand id for both registering *and* voting on the door. the latter requirement is unnecessary and almost certainly bullshit designed to deprive some people of the vote

for instance, in the UK, you generally get on the electoral roll by paying council tax at an address, though you can register separately if you don't pay CT (i.e. you're a student). once you're registered, that's it, you're done. when an election comes along you get a card to take to the polling station (though it isn't mandatory to present the card)

what you don't get is id'd at the door, or have to provide further proof once you're registered at an address

In Canada we're required to present the voting card you get in the mail and separate government-issued ID, but we're also a country with a broken election system.

Captain wrote:In Canada we're required to present the voting card you get in the mail and separate government-issued ID, but we're also a country with a broken election system.

That’s somewhat misleading. You’re not required to present the voting card. You do need two pieces of ID however the list is long and many aren’t “government issued”. A credit card and utility bill is enough.

https://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?s ... dex&lang=e

You're right, my bad. I assumed the voting card was mandatory because it says to bring it with you and they always ask for it :paranoid:

Without getting too political about it, I think that the electoral college and voting districts are mostly to blame. I would condone an age limit for certain posts. In the 90's, the system felt relevant. After the last two elections, I can't say that I feel the same.

raw wrote:That's a broad stroke that doesn't even begin to cover the issue. Example: A state ID costs money, money that some people do not have. Typically, a utility bill or other form of identification (without a cost) is used to prevent an unintended (and illegal) poll tax.

My point is that while we have the "right", the fact that we have to enroll into something that should be automatically enrolled. The system is used to suppress votes.

As a citizen your automatically approved, just need to prove citizenship for tracking. A bill statement is not a secure document to prove citizenship. For example a DMV non-driver ID card from NY, the fees seem trivial(https://dmv.ny.gov/id-card/fees-refunds):
Fees for Standard Non-Driver ID Cards
STANDARD NON-DRIVER ID CARD------------------------------------VALID----FEE
Under age 62, your next birthday is within the next 6 months----4 years-----$9.50
Under age 62, your next birthday is more than 6 months away---8 yearS----$14.00
Under age 62 and receive SSI---------------------------------------10 years----$6.50
Age 62 or older-------------------------------------------------------10 years----$6.50
Age 62 or older and receive SSI-------------------------------------10 years----No Fee
Any age and receive temporary assistance---------------------------4 years----No Fee

Birth certificate or naturalization document are others, so where is this massive suppression? The court does not identify this as a substantial burden either: "The Court added that, although obtaining a government-issued photo identification is an inconvenience to voters, it surely does not qualify as a substantial burden." ***
*** Crawford v. Marion County Election Board, 128 S. Ct. 1610, 1621 (2008) (plurality). See Fourteenth Amendment, Voting and Ballot Access, infra.

I would vote to pass law to waive the fee for any citizen making less then 50K for example to end this debate and "get er done" so to speak.

Maybe I'm naive, but having a valid ID when going voting is a requirement here in The Netherlands as well. It doesn't seem like an outlandish requirement to me. It's used to make sure people don't vote in someone else's name or vote twice. I feel like calling ID a method to suppress voters is an overreaction to all the other voter suppression going on in the US.

in the UK we just present the card we get through the mail and they tick it off their (paper) list. then again, voter fraud in the UK is effectively zero, so there's no need for a solution to a non-existent problem

Eraser wrote:Maybe I'm naive, but having a valid ID when going voting is a requirement here in The Netherlands as well. It doesn't seem like an outlandish requirement to me. It's used to make sure people don't vote in someone else's name or vote twice. I feel like calling ID a method to suppress voters is an overreaction to all the other voter suppression going on in the US.

It's not that. A Republican talking point is about Voter ID on top of the numerous ways we can already prove our identity. The goal is a poll tax for the poor and to restrict access by any means on inconvenience possible. It is illegal to give someone water or food in some states now even if the folks have been waiting in line for HOURS AND HOURS because of Republicans cutting back drop box locations, voting hours, and mail-in ballots. It specifically targets minorities.

For me, let anyone who is a citizen vote. It should be a national holiday and the cost of any voter ID should be free. We have billions for endless wars but nothing for home...

seremtan wrote:in the UK we just present the card we get through the mail and they tick it off their (paper) list. then again, voter fraud in the UK is effectively zero, so there's no need for a solution to a non-existent problem

Who would have thought that old school "analog" paper solutions might work better than these over engineered unresponsive touchscreen voting machines running Windows XP, manufactured by companies with Republican interests, and charged to the government at overpriced rates. American capita..ahem... freedom at work!

raw wrote:It's not that. A Republican talking point is about Voter ID on top of the numerous ways we can already prove our identity. The goal is a poll tax for the poor and to restrict access by any means on inconvenience possible. It is illegal to give someone water or food in some states now even if the folks have been waiting in line for HOURS AND HOURS because of Republicans cutting back drop box locations, voting hours, and mail-in ballots. It specifically targets minorities.

[youtube]T7axA3dMRLI[/youtube]

obsidian wrote:

seremtan wrote:in the UK we just present the card we get through the mail and they tick it off their (paper) list. then again, voter fraud in the UK is effectively zero, so there's no need for a solution to a non-existent problem

Who would have thought that old school "analog" paper solutions might work better than these over engineered unresponsive touchscreen voting machines running Windows XP, manufactured by companies with Republican interests, and charged to the government at overpriced rates. American capita..ahem... freedom at work!

yeah if there's one thing we do pretty well around here, it's run an election, without fraud, with the results mostly in by the next day

the fact that the Tories haven't found a bullshit reason to fix something that isn't broken is a minor miracle

and there goes abortion rights

In the mean time in the Netherlands, last week the Dutch gov't voted in favor of getting rid of the mandatory 5 day wait time for abortions here.

HM-PuFFNSTuFF wrote:and there goes abortion rights

RIP Roe v. Wade
Jan 1973 - Jun 2022

You were so young. :tear:

real talk I just moved to Austin, TX from Melbourne, Australia. Going to Dallas this weekend and am very interested in seeing a big gun and hopefully not disagreeing with anyone holding said gun.

maybe Texas will actually secede this time. hopefully the war doesn't break out in the next 2 years while I'm still holding an apartment lease

glossy wrote:real talk I just moved to Austin, TX from Melbourne, Australia. Going to Dallas this weekend and am very interested in seeing a big gun and hopefully not disagreeing with anyone holding said gun.

maybe Texas will actually secede this time. hopefully the war doesn't break out in the next 2 years while I'm still holding an apartment lease

omfg, it's glossy. Long time no post. How's it going?

5 posts in over 10 years. Slacker…