Quake3World

Nah, you're not coming across as a cunt. I think the majority of the people share your sentiment. It's just bloody hard to do something about it unfortunately.

This guy too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BrueU4xd2w

Anjem Choudary. He had a church that he used to preach death to the west from before getting shut down, it took years for him only to change the name of his organisation then carry on, still runs demonstrations and talks from a street corner with his followers. There's a documentary done by the BBC called 'My Brother the Islamist', follows the story of a white brit guy growing up with his brother that gets converted to be a radical and attends his church, he was arrested before the olympics for terror plots and those 2 who hacked the guy up in Woolwich attended the same church and the same rallies. If you watch My Brother the Islamist you'll see he has a big following.

Here is refusing to condemn the attack the other day -
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22650053

My Brother the Islamist docu that I thought was pretty decent -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LorhdNH1C34

They also have groups go around streets hassling people telling them they should be following sharia law, I'm sure I remember poking fun at that.

Now I have never met a radical Muslim, I know plenty 'normal' and some might have views very different to mine and they're quite free to express their opinions, London appears very different but this isn't even about freedom of speech imo. The 1st thing that's shouted out at the beginning of donnies vid is *fuck the police*, that is a public order offence that I've been had with. Anjem Choudary continues to incite violence and racial hatred under the guise of 'free speech', if we can't revoke citizenship or deport these fuckers then they should be facing a dose of justice.

Its bollocks and makes a mockery of free speech and why it's a flawed concept cos it gives any idiot with a soapbox a voice to reach idiots without one.

Where's Abu Hamza now ?

Maybe the west should lead the fucking rest of the world alone and this shit wouldn't happen?...

Agreed - but then people would hate us for not helping other people in need

scared? wrote:Maybe the west should lead the fucking rest of the world alone and this shit wouldn't happen?...

Did you mean "leave" instead of "lead"?
Your contribution was almost profound...damned auto-correct

Yeah dipshit I meant leave. I guess autocorrect fixed my typo like that...u gonna be okay about it?...

Eraser wrote:
Look at it like this: what's worse? Men dressed in dresses shouting that the police should burn in hell or British teens attacking and fighting with police, throwing rocks or worse at them, damaging public property and putting cars on fire just because their favorite football team lost a game?

Whilst these extremist's beliefs certainly don't reflect the muslim majority, the difference is that pro islamic hate demonstrations instigated by cunts like Choudray encourage easily led, weak minded, uneducated muslim followers up and down the country to barbarically murder people, such as we've seen, not just burning cars and throwing punches. There's free speech here, and likewise in the US protected by the first amendment, but then there's speech so inflammatory that imo it really should be banned, particularly since the UK has experienced terrorist acts so obviously inspired by it.

Also, Choudary saying to that girl "if you're non muslim you're destined for hellfire" is just as misguided and ignorant as those westboro baptist church shitstains. He should be kicked out of the country along with abu hamza.

Anyone see newsnight last night? Choudary doesn't condemn the attack. What a surprise.

All Christians...real ones...believe any non Christians will burn in hell...

That's like saying all real Muslims are radicals if you dissect the beliefs, but this is not what we're on about.

No...ur not a real Christian if u pick and choose the parts to follow or not...

Moderate Christians aren't real Christians and they are worse than the fundies cuz they enable the morons...

Way to miss a point

As a muslim you have a choice between all life being sacred or all infidels burning, but that's not what we're on about.

Don Carlos wrote:We are an open country who believes in tolerance and free speech, but the laws are wrong when a 15 year old lad can be arrested for calling someone gay on twitter but a Muslim clerk who asks for people to kill others in the name of his god can carry on as arresting him would be deemed as racist.

i'd be interested to know specifically which Muslim "clerk" it was who incited violence but somehow got away with it

i'd also be interested to know why you think that an attachment to tolerance and free speech is widespread in this country. my impression is that, by and large, people are 'tolerant' only of the views they tolerate. in a genuinely free country, if you called Trevor McDonald (for example) "a big gay nigger faggot" on Twitter, people would rightly conclude that you were a massive tool, and probably tell you so. by contrast, in this actual country, you won't only get called a massive tool, but also a posse of the pious and thin-skinned would rat you out to the police, who would immediately 'investigate the matter' before arresting you, charging you with a hate crime, then making sure you get banged up for as long as some rapists

DRuM wrote:Also, Choudary saying to that girl "if you're non muslim you're destined for hellfire" is just as misguided and ignorant as those westboro baptist church shitstains. He should be kicked out of the country along with abu hamza.

why? if someone came up to you in the street and said "if you don't believe in fairies, you're destined for the dungeons of Mordor" you'd laugh in their face. when people like this guy talk this kind of delusional bollocks, the only proper response should be derisive laughter, not boo-hoo offence-taking. we've got too many laws against free speech in this country without adding to the pile

Eraser wrote: Terrorism is about intimidation and spreading fear. Whether or not that's religiously motivated is irrelevant.

Didn't mean to imply terrorism was strictly religiously motivated. Among Feedback's other words were "Islam" and "Muslim," as if he were glad those words weren't mentioned yet, because in his mind, this event had nothing to do with them. My lack of recognition towards the word "terrorist" isn't related to my comments about islam.

DRuM wrote: Whilst these extremist's beliefs certainly don't reflect the muslim majority

Careful there; it's not the majority in a way, but it is definitely not a tiny minority.

seremtan wrote:

DRuM wrote:Also, Choudary saying to that girl "if you're non muslim you're destined for hellfire" is just as misguided and ignorant as those westboro baptist church shitstains. He should be kicked out of the country along with abu hamza.

why? if someone came up to you in the street and said "if you don't believe in fairies, you're destined for the dungeons of Mordor" you'd laugh in their face. when people like this guy talk this kind of delusional bollocks, the only proper response should be derisive laughter, not boo-hoo offence-taking. we've got too many laws against free speech in this country without adding to the pile

To be fair I've had Christians shout that at me walking past Newport market. I think he's right though, that Choudary fella prays on weak minded individuals, it's like violent conspiracy theorists that have been lead down the garden path and we know these views are rejected by the wider muslim societies in Britain. In the docu I linked above when they were looking for a mosque to pray in you seen a bunch of Muslims walk off looking as if they thought those guys were nuts.

He's still involved in organisations that get banned by terrorist laws only to be re-labelled to preach the same bullshit, like going bankrupt and opening the new business in your wifes name. Always anti-west themed too. This is kinda why I'm saying this is not about free speech and the laws that should be made but the abuse of freedom of speech. It's bollocks that West Boro baptist church can picket soldiers funerals just as its bollocks that this guy can go up and down the country claiming the 9/11 attacks or the 7/7 bombings a stroke of tactical genius.

He has strong links to militant organisations and has claimed to have trained freedom fighters in the UK. During the Boston bombings I was digging the yanks about looking at the root causes instead of blaming it on misfortune, well I honestly believe that the finger should be pointed firmly at hate mongering cunts like these and is the reason why organisations like Sinn Fein managed to absolve themselves of any crimes by adopting the freedom of speech 'card' and not denying nor confirming their involvment with the IRA. The yanks might have been funding the political branch of the IRA but we were the fucking cunts that allowed the political branch to exist.

More incoherent babbling from the red font guy...does anybody even finish reading a single sentence from this dip shit before getting bored?...

seremtan wrote:

DRuM wrote:Also, Choudary saying to that girl "if you're non muslim you're destined for hellfire" is just as misguided and ignorant as those westboro baptist church shitstains. He should be kicked out of the country along with abu hamza.

why? if someone came up to you in the street and said "if you don't believe in fairies, you're destined for the dungeons of Mordor" you'd laugh in their face. when people like this guy talk this kind of delusional bollocks, the only proper response should be derisive laughter, not boo-hoo offence-taking. we've got too many laws against free speech in this country without adding to the pile

Yeah, I wasn't very clear but I was making reference to my first sentence. That he should be kicked out for indoctrinating hatred of the west to his muppets and encouraging them to slice some heads off.

scared? wrote:More incoherent babbling from the red font guy...does anybody even finish reading a single sentence from this dip shit before getting bored?...

Don't be shy flower, tell me what you really think ?

DRuM wrote:

seremtan wrote:
why? if someone came up to you in the street and said "if you don't believe in fairies, you're destined for the dungeons of Mordor" you'd laugh in their face. when people like this guy talk this kind of delusional bollocks, the only proper response should be derisive laughter, not boo-hoo offence-taking. we've got too many laws against free speech in this country without adding to the pile

Yeah, I wasn't very clear but I was making reference to my first sentence. That he should be kicked out for indoctrinating hatred of the west to his muppets and encouraging them to slice some heads off.

He's from Luton :P

scared? wrote:More incoherent babbling from the red font guy...does anybody even finish reading a single sentence from this dip shit before getting bored?...

nope

Fuck muslims ?

losCHUNK wrote: He's from Luton :P

Bah, very true. Don't know why I thought he'd come to the UK from somewhere else.

losCHUNK wrote:He's still involved in organisations that get banned by terrorist laws only to be re-labelled to preach the same bullshit, like going bankrupt and opening the new business in your wifes name. Always anti-west themed too. This is kinda why I'm saying this is not about free speech and the laws that should be made but the abuse of freedom of speech. It's bollocks that West Boro baptist church can picket soldiers funerals just as its bollocks that this guy can go up and down the country claiming the 9/11 attacks or the 7/7 bombings a stroke of tactical genius.

you don't think that maybe by actively participating in and/or supporting criminal wars of aggression against Muslim countries, or rendition, or drone strikes that kill loads of kids, we might actually be doing a better job of selling the idea of jihad than any raging imam? if England were to suddenly send the military in to occupy Wales, kidnapping Welsh people and taking them to be tortured, or firing Hellfire missiles into downtown Newport at rush hour, then lying about the whole thing to an ignorant, dick-sucking corporate media, how would you react?

i was just watching a talk that Jeremy Scahill (author of Dirty Wars) was giving, in which he mentioned a village in Yemen where the-nebulous-group-of-like-minded-idiots-generally-referred-to-as-"al-Qaeda" came knocking one day, trying to get people interested in jihad against the Great Satan America. no one was interested. then one day the village was flattened by a drone strike. the next day, they were interested

(p.s. for the purposes of this debate, i'm going to assume people on this board aren't so stupid as to confuse 'analysis of cause' with 'justification')

Aye. I argued the same in the Boston bombs thread, just in this case we can see a source of radicalisation if you decrease the scope. That dude that went hacking at peoples heads was radicalised by sects in our country that try to help the terrorists we were fighting. That dude was ranting nonsense in the clip n all, being Nigerian descent and a British immigrant I'm willing to bet our government has done nothing to harm him, his family nor countrymen what so ever. So where did he learn this bollocks he was shouting, about his women witnessing beheadings in the street ?. I don't doubt that but is that our fault ?. He was a practicing Catholic up to University.

Back to the wider world then you can completely understand how pissed off they are. We have pulled out these countries though in the blind hope democracy will flourish no ?, are we droning pakis ?, we've sided with palestine in a vote that went against our closest allies, public opinion on both wars was always shit and only entered when international opinion favoured it maybe ?. I'm guessing I'm missing out loads of British intervention that lead back generations but in comparison France, China or Russia can be considered more oppressive to islamists don't you think ?.

When enforcing the no fly zone in Libya with American help the evil terrorists turned a load of their population against us, so we can't win either way anymore anyway . Britain is now fighting a propaganda war with a religion and cuntbags like Choudray are the face of it.

French soldier stabbed in neck in Paris
http://news.sky.com/story/1095605/frenc ... k-in-paris