Final cut and osx on intel chips

[saturn]

if it's so easy, why don't they port more games to the mac-ppc platform? Because it's not profitable for niche market (not that I miss them, nor that I don't have every piece of software for the mac that I need)

you're missing the point...

your program an app designed for os x, you code for the os x libraries and the os x application layer... then APPLE do all the porting for the different computer architectures in OS X itself. Every release of every OS X operating system in the last 5 years has had a x86 port. The applications interact with the operating system and it interfaces with the hardware... which hardware it's interfacing with has little or no concern to the software itself. Does this make more sense and explain why games aren't released on os x?

not really, but I know the answer already. It's not profitable.

[Turbanator]

you guys are overreacting like little girlies...

when you go and buy final cut studio pro hd super turbo edition 2 years from now, on launch day, it's hardly gonna say on the box "Requirements: Intel Mac, OS 11 etc". It'll say "OS 11". There is HARDLY ANY code changing required when moving apps from powerpc mac and intel mac, all software will still be released for both platforms, it doesn't make financial sense to miss out such a big market over a little bit of work. They ported mathmatica in 20 lines... jesus man... and it took 1 man less than 2 hours to find those 20 lines... do you know how complex mathmatica is?

To be fair, most of Mathematica is written in Mathematica. (see: Emacs).

I'm not complaining about software support, I'm complaining about performace -- I've been distinctly underwhelmed with the performace of a brand new 2Ghz G5. Knowing that this is as good as it will get in terms of performance on this G5 has pretty much sealed the deal for me. The thing is going back, restocking fee or no.

Besides, it has a green stuck pixel that annoys the fuck out of me.

if you geniuely think your G5 is slow...

I had to convert some avi files into a dvd movie. I used a Intel P4 3.6ghz and my co-worked used a 2.7ghz dual g5... the g5 took less than a quater of the time to convert the file formats, i was doing 4 equal length files and the first had hardly finished by the time my co-worked shouted "done" from the other side of the room... and you reckon G5 architecture is slow?

[Turbanator]

if it's so easy, why don't they port more games to the mac-ppc platform? Because it's not profitable for niche market (not that I miss them, nor that I don't have every piece of software for the mac that I need)

you're missing the point...

your program an app designed for os x, you code for the os x libraries and the os x application layer... then APPLE do all the porting for the different computer architectures in OS X itself. Every release of every OS X operating system in the last 5 years has had a x86 port. The applications interact with the operating system and it interfaces with the hardware... which hardware it's interfacing with has little or no concern to the software itself. Does this make more sense and explain why games aren't released on os x?

not really, but I know the answer already. It's not profitable.

the point is, this has little change in hardware has little to no effect for developers, it's apples choice and apple have to recode their kernels and translation layers, but developers and continue using their xcode tools and building for mac, and (in theory) 90% of apps should just work when they try out their new intel mac. All this is theoretical ofcourse because I don't have an intel mac to play with

[Therac-26]

you guys are overreacting like little girlies...

when you go and buy final cut studio pro hd super turbo edition 2 years from now, on launch day, it's hardly gonna say on the box "Requirements: Intel Mac, OS 11 etc". It'll say "OS 11". There is HARDLY ANY code changing required when moving apps from powerpc mac and intel mac, all software will still be released for both platforms, it doesn't make financial sense to miss out such a big market over a little bit of work. They ported mathmatica in 20 lines... jesus man... and it took 1 man less than 2 hours to find those 20 lines... do you know how complex mathmatica is?

To be fair, most of Mathematica is written in Mathematica. (see: Emacs).

I'm not complaining about software support, I'm complaining about performace -- I've been distinctly underwhelmed with the performace of a brand new 2Ghz G5. Knowing that this is as good as it will get in terms of performance on this G5 has pretty much sealed the deal for me. The thing is going back, restocking fee or no.

Besides, it has a green stuck pixel that annoys the fuck out of me.

if you geniuely think your G5 is slow...

I had to convert some avi files into a dvd movie. I used a Intel P4 3.6ghz and my co-worked used a 2.7ghz dual g5... the g5 took less than a quater of the time to convert the file formats, i was doing 4 equal length files and the first had hardly finished by the time my co-worked shouted "done" from the other side of the room... and you reckon G5 architecture is slow?

I don't have a PowerMac, though, I've got an iMac. Single processor, less than half the FSB, etc.

If I was satisfied with how fast it was, I wouldn't care. But after spending way more than I usually spend on a computer on a Mac, and getting a rather underwhelming experience in response, I'm really not happy to begin with.

The stuck pixel and the lack of future for this platform just annoy me further. I could live with any of them, I guess, but all three are annoying me.

[Turbanator]

oh and the reason games aren't ported is because the games are written for the windows api's, such as opengl and directx.... opengl ports are common as you know, as little work is required to port it, but direct x NEVER happens because the api simply doesn't exist on mac.

[Turbanator]

To be fair, most of Mathematica is written in Mathematica. (see: Emacs).

I'm not complaining about software support, I'm complaining about performace -- I've been distinctly underwhelmed with the performace of a brand new 2Ghz G5. Knowing that this is as good as it will get in terms of performance on this G5 has pretty much sealed the deal for me. The thing is going back, restocking fee or no.

Besides, it has a green stuck pixel that annoys the fuck out of me.

if you geniuely think your G5 is slow...

I had to convert some avi files into a dvd movie. I used a Intel P4 3.6ghz and my co-worked used a 2.7ghz dual g5... the g5 took less than a quater of the time to convert the file formats, i was doing 4 equal length files and the first had hardly finished by the time my co-worked shouted "done" from the other side of the room... and you reckon G5 architecture is slow?

I don't have a PowerMac, though, I've got an iMac. Single processor, less than half the FSB, etc.

If I was satisfied with how fast it was, I wouldn't care. But after spending way more than I usually spend on a computer on a Mac, and getting a rather underwhelming experience in response, I'm really not happy to begin with.

The stuck pixel and the lack of future for this platform just annoy me further. I could live with any of them, I guess, but all three are annoying me.

so you paid what for your mac?
what size screen is it?
how much does that size of screen alone retail for by a decent "PC" manufactuer?
what processor is it? what's that equivilent to taking a single 2.7ghz g5 to be equal to 3.6ghz intel (rough, worst case scenario, estimation).

Do you think you could get a better deal if you build the machine as a SFF and purchased the screen seperately.... keyboard mouse and everything... wifi? bluetooth? do you?

[Turbanator]

btw: I work for a company who were the largest apple reseller in europe (until we converted to an apple retailer)... we have the 2nd biggest apple retail store in the uk (first one being apple store regent st). I am not one bit worried about my apple sales performance over the coming months.

[saturn]

you can tell us over a month how the sales have been.

i'm fucking happy with my apple powerbook since it's a solid combo of hardware and OS. I just have a few concerns about the consequences of this third major switch since 10 years.

It would be a shame if there would be an Osborne effect. Apple will still have their iPod and iTunes franchise though.

[Turbanator]

£1200 for 20" imac 2.0ghz, 512mb, 250gb, wifi, bluetooth here...

£400 for a dell 20" widescreen (normally 550, but 25% off at the moment).
£805 for dell dimension 3000, 3.0ghz, 512mb, 160gb, no wifi no bluetooth

dell is £5 more expensive... can you wall mount the dell?

[saturn]

You don't have to convince the mac users here, Turbs

[Turbanator]

you can tell us over a month how the sales have been.

oh, i'm waiting and watching, don't worry about that

The few customers I'm going to loose are techs who panic about the future... average joe consumer will still buy... and to be honest, the techs always buy from the apple store online and blag an educational discount... so no damage here.

[dzjepp]

apple

[Turbanator]

You don't have to convince the mac users here, Turbs

i know i know... i'm as shocked as everyone else when i got the call today confirming this... but after thinking it over for an hour on the train, i dont think it'll be too bad

[saturn]

you can tell us over a month how the sales have been.

oh, i'm waiting and watching, don't worry about that

The few customers I'm going to loose are techs who panic about the future... average joe consumer will still buy... and to be honest, the techs always buy from the apple store online and blag an educational discount... so no damage here.

i'll use that equation of yours to convince a mate of mine to buy that iMac he's been lusted all over for the last couple of months. He's slipping back to the PC site cause he thinks it's a bit too expensive for him.

I've purchased an ADC account to get 20% discount on my system
Plus I get Tiger DVDs+Developer CDs every month (also 2 Spotlight OS X t-shirts).

Well, over 2 years would be a good idea to purchase a new Intel PowerMac system

[mjrpes]

so you paid what for your mac?
what size screen is it?
how much does that size of screen alone retail for by a decent "PC" manufactuer?
what processor is it? what's that equivilent to taking a single 2.7ghz g5 to be equal to 3.6ghz intel (rough, worst case scenario, estimation).

Do you think you could get a better deal if you build the machine as a SFF and purchased the screen seperately.... keyboard mouse and everything... wifi? bluetooth? do you?

Are you trying to argue that Apple computers cost the same or less than PC computers when everything is brought together?

[SplishSplash]

if it's so easy, why don't they port more games to the mac-ppc platform?

Because there's no DirectX in MacOS.

[saturn]

Turb pointed that out already.

[SplishSplash]

Turb pointed that out already.

I know how forgetful you can be.

[saturn]

Who are you?

[saturn]

p.s. Anandtech Coverstory + photos

http://www.anandtech.com/tradeshows/sho ... i=2438&p=1

[Billy Bellend]

yea told yeas so.

now you new apple users can feel what its like to be an old apple user.

[mjrpes]

Mr. Anand Lal Shimpi brings up a good point. If Mr. Steve Jobs is so worried about performance per watt, then why not go with AMD?

I bet it has something to do with Apple + PentiumM = cumbath.

[Billy Bellend]

hi mjrpes how are you doing?

[mjrpes]

very well thank you top of the day

[Canis]

Mr. Anand Lal Shimpi brings up a good point. If Mr. Steve Jobs is so worried about performance per watt, then why not go with AMD?

I bet it has something to do with Apple + PentiumM = cumbath.

Mobile options from intel are good. I'm rather curious about the 64-bit hype from apple about the G5. Will they continue 64-bit support, or will they drop down to 32-bit with the P4?