Quake3World

Psss..





Yeah, Q3 and expecially CPMA is still part of my life.
And as I have started to remake a map some time ago, I thought I got to finish it soon.
Otherwise it would rot on my harddisk...

And as I like the gameplay of the map, I won't withhold it from you and last but not least to get feedback on details. The mainlayout won't be changed anymore.

I'm satisfied with the current structures. There are just some cosmetics to be done.

Maybe the itemset must be altered slightly. I have added an GL whilst removing the SG as it didn't fit right in there IMO.

To break up the mild coffetones I have added a warm orange colortone to the theme.

I'm glad about any suggestions or just impressions you have/had.

To do:
- visuals
- items?
- improving botsupport
- waiting for feedback....

Download location

Thanks in advance and have fun,

sum :icon31:

1 - trying textures/pukka3tourney5/e8yarrow.TGA...

2 - Still can't shoot through a lot of grates (the ones at YA and LG for example).

3 - I see some sparklies in the edges of the grey part above PG

4 - The texture of the light above PG is misaligned.

5 - The suspended column with the lights opposite to RA is unclipped (you can get inside it).

6 - The lights at MH are unclipped/nonsolid except for their little bottom parts. So are the ones behind YA. The lights at the top of the curved stairs should be clipped/solid too because you can RJ up there.

7 - The lighting in the MH is very flat (hard to perceive depth).

I think there are a bit too many zebra patterns in some areas (lower RL and curved stairs), which makes it look a bit too 'busy' for my taste. Perhaps you can try to make some bigger light/dark surfaces and more horizontal bands.

There are only a few of those 'realistic' looking lights left (above GL, PG and some other places). Would be nice to replace them too with something that fits the theme of the map. I suggested replacing the gratings with brushwork too before in a previous topic about this map. It could look nicer.

Wow, looks nice

The top teleport exit has invisible floor textures visible in the grating next to it. Exit the teleporter and look directly left at your feet.

The level plays out very slowly. Something about the lift area is still too fiddly and the basement bit is too cramped around the pole area. The roof is a little too low down there too.

The central room with that block coming down from the ceiling works OK, although I coming into the room from the LG my instinct is to use it to jump up to the top level, but the grated piece is clipped off.

The pad of ground around the YA can be used to jump up to the RL bit next to it, but it's a very small clip and a buggy trick to pull off.

The teleporters look very budget compared to the rest of the level. The yellow and brown them works nicely but the teleporters dont fit into the theme at all. The grate texture is a similar problem - I'd encourage you to go with genuinely custom textures throughout the level since you're already halfway there.

On gameplay, the level is cramped and small but plays out very slowly, which is a bit odd.

Foo wrote:The teleporters look very budget compared to the rest of the level. The yellow and brown them works nicely but the teleporters dont fit into the theme at all. The grate texture is a similar problem - I'd encourage you to go with genuinely custom textures throughout the level since you're already halfway there.

I agree they don't really fit in but for some reason they don't bug me as much as those few remaining lights with stock textures.

Btw did you play this in OSP promode again? :x That could be slower because of the spawns.

Yep. CPM over LAN.

I think the slowness aspect is due to there being so many tight twists and turns, you can never really gain good speed in any areas.

which is not an issue if you're an experienced CPM player

I'll play this vs. you one of these days sum

voodoochopstiks wrote:which is not an issue if you're an experienced CPM player

Oooooh burn

It's not an issue on any accepted CPM map that springs to mind. If we were shooting for elitist, it wouldn't be posted here at all.

Looks good. Finish it already

Somebody play me on this.

EDIT: Found somebody.

Neither of us knew the map very well and I definitely have rusty movement since I haven't played cpma in awhile, but you get the idea.

Feedback:
-I sorta felt like what others have said, that the map is too tight and you bump into things in areas. Can never really get up to speed like I feel you should be able to. Yes, this is partly due to my rusty movement, but it is also due to the map. However, this can be fixed pretty easily I think. I'd remove a lot of the obstructions that are slowing you down right now. Namely, the pillar down by the MH/GA/water needs to be removed. Just gets in the way of movement. Also, the pipes sticking out from walls for no reason other than visual effect need to be removed since they make things tighter and you can snag on them. Some of the floors need to be smoothed out, especially the dirt floor at the bototm. I'd remove all those little slopes in the dirt (like around GA) since they just mess up your movement. Also, on the upper floors try to keep the "step-ups" to a minimum so it is all one flat surface. Also on the top floor I believe, I'd angle some of the corners to a 45 degree angle so you don't get abruptly stopped so easily if you clip a corner as you're running by.

-Both teleporters seem to take you to odd locations. The RA teleporter takes you to that ledge and you have to remember each time to do a 180 and if you make the turn too tight you run into the wall. I'd move the ledge to the far side (along the outside wall of the map) and have the tele point you toward the middle of the map (and lose the wall dividing the 2 sections) so that you just do a straight-forward telejump. As far as the water tele goes, I don't like that it takes you to essentially the middle of a staircase. Not sure what you can do here. Not even sure if you need that tele.

-There's a few ceilings you bump your head on that are too low. Above platform that ceiling is a bit too low (yes, I know you want splash damage there). Also, coming from YA to RA atrium that ceiling is way too low. I don't know what you can do here since that path has to be there.

-Make grates consistent

lookin pretty nice there. It's a damn shame I still dont have my copy of Q4 =(

Silicone_Milk wrote:lookin pretty nice there. It's a damn shame I still dont have my copy of Q4 =(

It's a Q3 map. :icon29:

To illustrate a couple of vwv's excellent points I took a few screenies:



Cosmetically, these corners are bland and obstruct movement around the area. Opening it up a little by cutting off the corner on the right would allow smoother transitions between the teleporter exits and the corridor, and would probably allow some trim stuff to be added to coffetise the wall.



This shot illustrates the point about light trims thinning out space. Fortunately, there's a thick wall behind it so recessing the lights should be simple. Perhaps angling the walls or ceiling here would get away from the 'I was part of a block map' feeling this corridor gives off?



Dropping the floor under the RA down to the floor would close off the odd space where the 50h sits. Also, you can get inside the light beam in the middle of the room and stand in it.

Cosmetically, another thing that strikes me is the abrupt cutoff at the top of the level - it's all flat and boring above head height and you feel very enclosed even where there's 'open' sky above you. Giving some depth outside the reachable areas would look good - even some simple towers looming upwards.

After watching wvw's demo through the same kind of slowness became apparent in the way the level was being played. I count roughly 6 unique areas in the level where the player can be isolated with stuff to occupy a few seconds:
1. YA room
2. Curved staircase
3. Basement
4. RA Room
5. Top corridor
6. Middle corridor
I think this is what's slowing the pace down so, interaction between the 2 players is just a tad too sparse.

I know you said no major changes but it occured to me that you could flip the YA room entirely and this would open up the lower YA corridor a lot more, and make the jump up out of the YA room useful. Also tempted to state that putting the MH on the RA spot and putting a YA down where the MH was might balance things out better.

Thanks for any given feedback (especially Foo and wviperw), I'll have to get clear about your suggestions and think about what I still got to do. The next few weeks I'll be on it..

I agree with most thoughts, but I doubt I will convert all of those. I'm too close to finish, and this map was for too long on my HDD now.
I'll try to speed the map up, dunno if its still posssible without any major changes.

Things I have already in mind:

- Grates keep consistent.
- Light/grate textures will be altered
- Final clipping will be done
- Lift will move faster
- playing vs voodoochopsticks
- rethink teleporter destinations
- Smoothing edges

sum

P.S. Maybe I'm not satisfied and work on a 2v2 version in the future. With an extra area and other itemsets. Could be fun.
Hope the 1v1 version turns out well though...

Otherwise it will be a fun FFA map :icon28:

sumatra wrote:Otherwise it will be a fun FFA map :icon28:

Needs ammo boxes for that, we tried a 3-man FFA with weaponstay and it all went horribly wrong ;(

Foo wrote:

sumatra wrote:Otherwise it will be a fun FFA map :icon28:

Needs ammo boxes for that, we tried a 3-man FFA with weaponstay and it all went horribly wrong ;(

sure, but only with secondary itemset, to load up.

Oeloe wrote:

Silicone_Milk wrote:lookin pretty nice there. It's a damn shame I still dont have my copy of Q4 =(

It's a Q3 map. :icon29:

Oh :icon32:

Just so used to seeing posting Quake 4 maps now on these forums.

In that case *downloads*

If you want a mirror location sumatra, --> RR-maps

roughrider wrote:If you want a mirror location sumatra, --> RR-maps

Thanks for the supply RR, will use it as soon as I'm finished with this one..

Np