Quake3World

Could the kind folks here, post a few links on what you need to start mapping for Quake 4, and links to good tutorials?

A few custom mapping related key bindings could be handy as well, e.g. for debuggin maps (the more obvious would be "noclip", "give all" etc.).

AFAICT: First steps:

• Get and install the retail version of Quake 4.
• Patch the game to v1.2.
• Make a "clean" (vanilla) duplicate of the Quake 4 game folder to be able to test for possibly missing custom content?
• ...

I assume that many tips pertinent for Doom 3 would also be useful for Quake 4?

With the information collected in this thread, I would then put together a new post dedicated to Q4 in our link resources sticky thread.


Presently I am thinking of trying my hand at a Q4 map, probably using the latest beta of GTKradiant 1.5.

Thanx.

Basic FAQ
http://www.gamedesign.net/node/1188

Quake 4 Directory Structure
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewto ... 841#117841

Ambient Light
http://www.gamedesign.net/node/1186

If making a mp map and want to test your maps layout at multiplayer speeds, while in game type in console "pm_speed 320".

Theres a few to get this topic started.

Official Id Software SDK for D3/Q4:
http://www.iddevnet.com

I could use some pointers too. The last time I messed around with the D3 engine was when D3 first came out, and I had problems with messy directories and editor issues that I'm sure can be solved by reading some documents by some more knowledgable people.

A few links, no idea how useful they are yet:

Quake 4 - modwiki
http://www.modwiki.net/wiki/Quake_4

(Quick check: Reveals comprehensive list of CVars and Console Commands)

And the huge Tutorial list: http://www.modwiki.net/wiki/Tutorial_list


Doom 3 - modwiki
http://www.modwiki.net/wiki/Doom_3


Just found my mini-tutorials for D3, that should still be useful for Q4 (I hope ):

(AEon's) Mini-Tutorials based on MNeMiC Videos
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=5620

Quake 4 Debug Hud
http://www.iddevnet.com/quake4/DebugHud
This debug hud should be very useful for mappers.

Toireht wrote: If making a mp map and want to test your maps layout at multiplayer speeds, while in game type in console "pm_speed 320".

Ah... noted that as well when running a map with "devmap", I was surprised at the really slow running speed. You tip helps.

But, I also noted that a multiplayer map is not properly loaded via devmap, i.e. the some of the items are wrong (probably SP equivalents of the MP items).

So... how does one properly load a MP map in Q4?

(Sofar I had to start a MP server locally).

I smell an attempt to generate a FAQ

There is a lot of info out there, question is is it worth collecting.

Basically it seems to boil down to reading up on D3 information and using that for Q4 with a few exceptions.

I have heard mention of bots for Q4. Any link on those?

AEon wrote:

Toireht wrote: If making a mp map and want to test your maps layout at multiplayer speeds, while in game type in console "pm_speed 320".

So... how does one properly load a MP map in Q4?

(Sofar I had to start a MP server locally).

Steps on how to test a MP map

1. Make a anyname.cfg in *yourQuake4installation\q4base\* and add these 3 lines to it

seta si_pure "0"
seta si_map "mp/yourmapname"
spawnserver

2. Add a info->info_player_deathmatch

3. BSP (compile the map)

4 Type exec anyname.cfg in the console

***When in this mode, NO saves are made to the map, the only way to change the map is to close quake 4 and reload it, then go to the editor, if you don't it won't save anything to the map... so use this only to test your map and then quit quake 4 and reload your map again in the editor.

Light Detail Tutorial
http://www.doom3world.org/phpbb2/viewto ... 014e7580d2

This is also a big help:
http://www.iddevnet.com/quake4/Quake4SDK

Did one actually need the SDK when only mapping?

I.e. you do not plan to add/make/import models and such?

obsidian wrote:Official Id Software SDK for D3/Q4:
http://www.iddevnet.com

Mappers will want to pay particular attention to the section of that site regarding the addon.cfg file:

http://www.iddevnet.com/quake4/LevelEditor_MPMapDefs

...which reminds me--I still need to add the addon.cfg to my own map.

AEon wrote: Did one actually need the SDK when only mapping?

I.e. you do not plan to add/make/import models and such?

Nope, no SDK needed if just making a new map.

spawnserver mp/myubermap works fine too

pjw wrote:Nope, no SDK needed if just making a new map.

You won't need to actually download the SDK files, but IdDevNet has some pretty good resources.

It does contain a lot of potentially useful info if you do plan on using any other custom content like textures and material (the new "shader") files, as well as a few good pointers and tips.

hemostick wrote:spawnserver mp/myubermap works fine too

Ahh... the more "lengthy method" above had me really worried. It just could not be *that* complicated to test your map in MP.


Map Paths
That brings up another point: Where are multiplayer maps placed now in Q4?
(I read the paths mentioned in the wiki, but they did not really nail down things).

Just double checked for Q3A, out mp maps reside in maps/ without using e.g. maps/<mapname>/.

In Q4 Raven places all their maps in maps/mp/ but I have seen several mentions in tutorials that folks simply place their MP maps in maps/ as well?!

Personally I also prefer to type map <mapname> without an explicit path. Though something like maps/<mapname>/ might also be a good idea?

What are the folks here at LEM going with?



Level Design Details / Lighting / Shadows

Another thing that really makes me pause are the "nice" visuals, or more how efficiently they get turned off. With my 2.54 MHz machine and X800, I have to turn down all the settings to "low" when playing in 1280x1024. And that works OK, maps still look "OK". But since all the lighting seems to have gone and also the shadows, I am wondering why actually bother with the lighting? Or any fancy shadows (that IMO look crummy anyway).

What I am trying to say, I never felt that lighting was "optional" in Q3A, it was what made the maps look awesome. But in Q4 MP I really have my doubts about the usefulness of either. I.e. everything should be "flatly lit" anyway.

AEon wrote:

Level Design Details / Lighting / Shadows

Another thing that really makes me pause are the "nice" visuals, or more how efficiently they get turned off. With my 2.54 MHz machine and X800, I have to turn down all the settings to "low" when playing in 1280x1024. And that works OK, maps still look "OK". But since all the lighting seems to have gone and also the shadows, I am wondering why actually bother with the lighting? Or any fancy shadows (that IMO look crummy anyway).

What I am trying to say, I never felt that lighting was "optional" in Q3A, it was what made the maps look awesome. But in Q4 MP I really have my doubts about the usefulness of either. I.e. everything should be "flatly lit" anyway.

Totally agree. I never turn on the lighting when I play anymore. Just bogs down the overall performance for me =\

AEon wrote:Map Paths
That brings up another point: Where are multiplayer maps placed now in Q4?

In Q4 Raven places all their maps in maps/mp/ but I have seen several mentions in tutorials that folks simply place their MP maps in maps/ as well?!

Single player maps (campaigns) go in maps/game but MP maps go in maps/mp per definition (afaik).

AEon, might I suggest that we add what you get in here to the "Starting Q3 mapping resources" Thread and rename that to "Starting Quake mapping, Reources". Reason I say that is we are at our limit in stickies. So we either have to get rid of a sticky or include this into that other one. Which IMO, would make more sense to include in with other one since it all has to do with mapping.


Just my $0.0000001 worth

roughrider,
I was thinking of adding a new post to the link resource thread specifically for Q4, using things in this thread plus anything useful I come across. E.g.

"I:\Games\Quake 4 Demo\Quake4.exe" +set com_allowconsole 1 +disconnect

the disconnect part skips the movies and starts the game with the menu.

I had actually also thought of renaming that sticky to Starting Q3A / Q4 Mapping - Link Resources, but I see the thread has already been renamed according to your suggestion. Either way is OK I guess.

Presently I am collecting diverse information about getting the editing started. Possibly this could end up in a LEM FAQ ... E.g. a autoexec.cfg for Q4 mapping may be interesting.

Good time to start getting back into mapping. Especially with Quake Wars around the corner, definitely looking forward to mapping for that!

If we can somehow merge some stickies together, that may be a good idea. Either that, or the possibility of a separate resources web page that we can link to from a sticky thread (the wiki page for instance).

Some sort of definitive beginner's guide would be a big bonus to the whole community.

Get your butt over to my place, just about everything you need to know is there and you won't have to wade through tonnes of crap to find it either!! Quake3Bits


AEon: For the lazy the link: Quake 4 editing and modding tips ... this includes:

• Normal maps - TIP : texture space and orientation
• Quake 4 "addon.conf" configuration file
• Creating mapsize data for Quake 4 MP maps
• r_lightdetaillevel [n]
• WARNING: Couldn't load map file
• Using 'inline' models
• Models not loading into the D3/Q4 editor
• 'Overbright' lights
• Texture rotation issues
• Quake 4 MP collision problems
• Quake 4 model rotation problem
• Types of 'surface' in Quake 4
• Custom DDS textures showing as 'black'
• Creating Quake 4 levelshots and map list entries
• Folder structure for MP level editing
• Where are the particle, articulated figures editors?
• Using ASE models in Quake 4
• Useful Quake 4 console commands
• How to test MP maps in Quake 4
• Anti Aliasing and the editor
• Starting the Quake 4 editor
• Using GTKRadiant to build a basic terrain
• Condump log.txt
• Converting old maps into Quake 4 and Doom 3

Looks very promissing.

...FAQ tests now in seperate thread...

AEon, as far as the thread name, that is no biggy really. We can change it to whatever we need it to be. The idea of having it as "Q3/Q4 mapping Resources" sounds good too and is closer to definative then what it is now, or was. At least when both are considered anyway.
kat also has a very good point. There are alot of helpful things floating around on his site and pointing to that stuff within a new combined resources thread would be a very good idea.
Also, when you were talking about specific items for q3 or q4, just making it plain in the particular post which one it belongs to would be best way to go about that, imo.

Too bad no body has magic dust that we can sprinkle on the forum and make it automatically edit itself and have everything we need .

Noted your comments, working on a very fist test version for the FAQ... collecting info as I get it... alas I can't yet test things because Q4 will take another 3-4 days to arrive

damnit, post a pic already Aeon

Hehe... I haven't built anything, I'll still trying to understand Q4 mapping

I'd really like to build something like q4dm1.

You should make that glowthingie in Q4 instead of Q3, since of the real time light there...