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Topic: [Hot Place] Beta ][ 2vs2/1vs1

sumatra
Insane Quaker

Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Posts: 325

Posted: 03-30-2005 01:24 PM

Hello everybody,

I'm up with a new beta, final-beta I think. It's a candidate for the 2on2 competition over at challenge-promode-forums,
so my time passes by, release date is april 5th.
It has not much changed on the structural side, only some itemswaps or other minor details.
I've mainly upgraded the visuals, given it some eyecandystuff.
Though I'm still not satisfied with my result, so perhaps you can give me some hints for adding more atmosphere,
to get my place really hot, so you take off all ya clothes !!

The feedback I would appreciate most is the one on itemplacement for the TDM (2v2) set. In spite of its for cpm, I think it plays also well with vanilla-q3. However I'm interested in your impressions and thoughts.

Issues I see:

- MH placement, too near to RA atm.
- RG
- PU
- Spawns

The 1on1-set should work as good as possible, had some nice matches against a mate. Though not sure about the YA-position.

It's a fastvis-compile, so if you get performance problems, they're fixed in the final-compile. Also the map is still not clipped/hinted so these are the things todo for the last few days. Also the lift-sounds will work properly in final .

Here the obligatory screenshot:

And here the Download-location: Hot Place Beta ][

Thanks in advance

sumatra

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^misantropia^
Mentor

Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 3958

Posted: 03-30-2005 02:31 PM

Nice map, has a good flow and it's very good looking too. Few nitpicks but here they are.

- You can grab the RA and both the RLs in under five seconds. And he who controls the RA+RLs, controls the map...

- The MH alcove. Just wait until someone grabs it and shaft-whore him to death. The poor sucker hasn't a chance of escaping. I actually kinda liked this

- A missing texture that gave me this error in the console:

Quote:
trying models/mapobjects/leafa.TGA...
WARNING: reused image env/gehenna/gehenna_rt.tga with mixed glWrapClampMode
parm
WARNING: reused image env/gehenna/gehenna_bk.tga with mixed glWrapClampMode
parm
WARNING: reused image env/gehenna/gehenna_lf.tga with mixed glWrapClampMode
parm
WARNING: reused image env/gehenna/gehenna_ft.tga with mixed glWrapClampMode
parm
WARNING: reused image env/gehenna/gehenna_up.tga with mixed glWrapClampMode
parm
WARNING: reused image env/gehenna/gehenna_dn.tga with mixed glWrapClampMode
parm

- An inverted or bad normal.

- Steep FPS drops and lots of overdraw in quite a few places. Notice the engine drawing nearly the entire map. You'll have to fix this.

- Bots are really retarded. Did you botclip things and use -forcesidesvisible when running bspc?

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sumatra
Insane Quaker

Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Posts: 325

Posted: 03-31-2005 08:48 AM

Hey,

^misantropia^ wrote:
Nice map, has a good flow and it's very good looking too.

Thanks, I'm glad you like it

^misantropia^ wrote:
A missing texture that gave me this error in the console:

Will be fixed.

^misantropia^ wrote:
You can grab the RA and both the RLs in under five seconds. And he who controls the RA+RLs, controls the map...

Haven't recognized yet, nice thought, will think about a solution...

^misantropia^ wrote:
Steep FPS drops and lots of overdraw in quite a few places. Notice the engine drawing nearly the entire map. You'll have to fix this

As I wrote in my post, this is only a fastvis-compile, so thats the reason for this issue, will be fullvised in Final.

^misantropia^ wrote:
Bots are really retarded. Did you botclip things and use -forcesidesvisible when running bspc?

Same for this, no Botclip at all till now. Wil be done.

sumatra

EDIT: Oh, and for the 1337 guys who cant wait here the missing texture.

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Todtsteltzer
The Afflicted

Joined: 28 Nov 2002
Posts: 634

Posted: 03-31-2005 10:43 AM

I tried this map with a clean (cpma) install and found out that there are also some missing water textures (from mapmedia.pk3):
Code:
trying textures/liquids/pool3d_5b.TGA...
WARNING: R_FindImageFile could not find 'textures/liquids/pool3d_5b.tga' in
shader 'textures/liquids/clear_ripple2'
Shader textures/liquids/clear_ripple2 has a stage with no image

Beside 'pool3d_5b.TGA' 'textures/liquids/pool3d_3b.tga' and 'textures/liquids/pool3d_6b.tga' have to be added, too.

Atmosphere:
What about adding some smoke above the lava pools to get this place really hot?
Another reason why the place doesn't look as hot as you want it to be, might be the blue lights you've used. Although I like the contrast, I think it's a bit like putting out the fire. Maybe changing the color of the lights to yellow or white will help.

Bots:
After compiling a new aas file (with the forcesidesvisible switch) the bots act smarter but still have problems with the plats. They just stood on top of the plats until I fragged them .

Item placement:
Personally I don't like the MH spot (1on1/FFA), because it's too much of a trap, and RA and MH are definitely too close in TDM.

Miscellaneous:
Did you use the skyfix switch when compiling your bsp?
This might be the reason for the messages about the 'mixed glWrapClampMode parm'. I don't know how the skybox looks with ATI cards but I can see small beams in the skybox, although I normally don't (Geforce FX 5900 XT).

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^misantropia^
Mentor

Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 3958

Posted: 03-31-2005 01:25 PM

Quote:
Item placement:
Personally I don't like the MH spot (1on1/FFA), because it's too much of a trap, and RA and MH are definitely too close in TDM.

In non-team games, the MH alcove is indeed a trap but that can be quite funny if you're into shaft-whoring

In 2v2 TDM a lot of the action revolves around the MH room so I think you should keep the MH where it is. The RA being so close makes it possible for a team to lock down that part of the map but the down team can counter that by grabbing the quad and going on a killing spree.

Quote:
I don't know how the skybox looks with ATI cards but I can see small beams in the skybox, although I normally don't (Geforce FX 5900 XT).

Same on a GeForce FX 5800.

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sock
The Illuminated

Joined: 08 Sep 2000
Posts: 1085

Posted: 03-31-2005 01:42 PM

In order to give the impression of something hot you need the right colour palette. In your screenshot you have too many contrasting colours. You have green grass and plants which symbolize something living and cool in colour tone and red hot light fixtures. I recommend you replace the grass with sand or a yellow/brown dirt. If you need example sand/dirt textures I released a organic set with my last map.

I also produced some dead coloured plants which I included in the texture pack I released. here's a sample of the dead stuff and some "alien like" plant leaves as well.

They work fine with the plant models I did and can be rotated easily into any position. If you need to see the models working in a test map download my latest map. (Link on my site)

The floor texture you use should blend from dirt/sand to rock at the edges. This can be done with very few polys and can be easily controlled with alpha blending on the edges. I have working examples of this on my site.

A location which needs to give the impression of "hot" needs similiar light tones of red/yellow/orange/white. That should be enough variety to get the lighting different enough for each area.

Hope that helps.
Sock

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sumatra
Insane Quaker

Joined: 12 Feb 2005
Posts: 325

Posted: 04-01-2005 12:33 PM

Thanks for replies guys, I'll think about all gameplay issues you mentioned, especially for MH/RA.

@Todtsteltzer:
I was also thinking of nice smokeclouds above the lava, but didnt find any fitting goodlooking smoketex.
Perhaps i have to try something with alphafade.
I also like the blue lights, give some nice contrast to the lavapits.
Some idea to get the bots working better with the lifts?
I'll try to switch off the skyfix option, probably this fixes the edges in the sky (Me rides an ATI Radeon XT800 )

@sock:
I like the texturepack as much. as your impressions or rather your suggestions for some cosmetics in the right areas. The colortheory of you works fine, I'll keep it in mind for lighten the areas with more realistic lighttones (shadows - cooler tones / lights - warm tones / lava - hotttt)
Perhaps I expressed not my vision of the visual style of the map.
I like the things you mentioned (yellow /brown/dirt/orange..),
but I wanna keep the style as in the picture in first post (on top).
The best would be the style of this pic would count about the entire map.
I think the green gives some clean (as you said) cool contrast to the lavapipe, i.e.
I also wanted to give emphasize some spots with hard blue contrast, I like the mix.

But here is what I still want to add/do:
- The lava needs to become more fluidy/gel-like with some rockwalls flowing lava out of.
- The blue is to heavy for now, perhaps decrease the amount of blue lights to set some accents.
- the plantmodels you created are awesome, will use them with pleasure.
- I had some problems with alphablending, but want to use it in the cave

summarized I'll give it more smoother orange-pastel-lighttones, stil keeping some blue accents.
Add more lava with perhaps some rivers/smoke above.
Only problem (that wont be fixed) my time is running out

helps much sock, thanks, I appreciate your work much.

sumatra

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voodoochopstiks
Lasery Roboty

Joined: 07 Jun 2004
Posts: 352

Posted: 04-01-2005 01:17 PM

What texture pack does sock speak of?

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