Quake3World.com :: View topic - Classic Doom better than New Doom................

Other than the common idea, I consider them different games. I like both, with a lean towards the classic dooms.

What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake.The Shambler needs some lovin'.

I really enjoyed Doom 3, but classic Doom has stood the test of time, and I don't know if Doom 3 will, especially with community support being as weak as it is.

The flash light was a good gameplay device, no matter what anybody tells you, but the focus on smaller amounts of enemies took something away from the game.

Having to reload weapons in single player was a bag o' shite, meaning you couldn't get that special Doom rythm going.
But darkness and light was great.

Monster closets and "BOO!" style scares were poorly executed, especially when compared to similar tricks used in classic Doom. With decent map design, you should be able to bring Doom's tricks and traps into a modern game (after all, Quake did it), but sliding doors became the order of the day.

I don't know, you could spend a long time picking holes in Doom 3, but the truth is, it's not as bad as everyone makes it out to be.
It's just not classic Doom.

What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake.
The Shambler needs some lovin'.

Mat Linnett wrote:

What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake.The Shambler needs some lovin'.

i thought Quake 4 WAS a follow up to the original quake? i duno like im completely ignorant of that subject seeing as i dont have quake 4 and have never played it

No, it was a follow up to Quake 2. Completely different world and storyline. Quake 1 & 2 had nothing to do with eachother.

scourge34 wrote:

No, it was a follow up to Quake 2. Completely different world and storyline. Quake 1 & 2 had nothing to do with eachother.

thing is, ive never played quake 2 either :icon26:

But damn, why did they make Quake 4 into the generic sci fi wankfest it was

Quake 2 had a certain style and atmosphere and they turned it into a Halo/Unreal Tourney cross over

the classic doom mod for d3 is great. i know it would've been seen as a bit of a cop-out, but i wish that'd been the commercial game.

as soon as it starts off and you hear the excellent instrumental remashing that sonicclang put together and see the old corridors vamped up in glistening 3d, it's like an idealised memory or something - great stuff.

I wish they could have done all the episodes though. That would have been the icing on the cake. I do appreciate what they did do at any rate. :icon14:

scourge34 wrote:

I wish they could have done all the episodes though. That would have been the icing on the cake. I do appreciate what they did do at any rate. :icon14:

theres doom 3 map editors isnt there? im sure someone will remake the other episodes in time....assuming that wont infringe on any copyrights....which it almost certainly will, hah

ps i heard theyre remaking commander keen and its meant to be simultaneously the most terrifying and most hilarious game ever created :paranoid:

dont fret, marathon owned.

dont fret, marathon owned.

i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac.

I didn't really like the cheap closet part of D3 like many people here but found myself much more pleased with the expansion.

MKJ wrote:

dont fret, marathon owned.

i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac.

I played marathon:infinity. pretty nice, although the sound of dying pfhors was quite ridiculous :P .

Hellmaker ? I used macDEU+macBSP

While Hellmaker was certainly friendlier (and actually had a grid to snap to... my textures were NEVER aligned in macDEU

), I liked the ability to mess around inside wads that *DEU provided.

hemostick wrote:

I didn't really like the cheap closet part of D3 like many people here but found myself much more pleased with the expansion.

MKJ wrote:

dont fret, marathon owned.

i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac.

I played marathon:infinity. pretty nice, although the sound of dying pfhors was quite ridiculous :P .

Hellmaker ? I used macDEU+macBSP

While Hellmaker was certainly friendlier (and actually had a grid to snap to... my textures were NEVER aligned in macDEU

), I liked the ability to mess around inside wads that *DEU provided.

aye, I made a mod once for Doom but that was with an app other than DEU.. something like WadHak or something? cant remember

the mod owned though, dubbed Rebel Imp, where the player was an imp and you had to fight using only fireballs and scratches :icon32:

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-13-2006 06:19 AM ]
Post subject:	Classic Doom better than New Doom................
I for one am of the opinion that the original Doom games are better than Doom 3. The original games had a certain timelessness about them that has been replaced in the new game by shameless pretension and hollywood-esque melodrama....does anyone else agree? Take the poll!

Author:	Scourge [ 10-13-2006 04:26 PM ]
Post subject:
Other than the common idea, I consider them different games. I like both, with a lean towards the classic dooms.

Author:	MKJ [ 10-16-2006 03:54 AM ]
Post subject:
classic doom hands down Doom3 was terrible, both as a Doom title and as a "horror" (laff) FPS game. UDoom is where its at \m/

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-16-2006 12:32 PM ]
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thank you! THANK YOU! finally someone who agrees with me. i posted a similar question over on PlanetDoom and, naturally, got torn apart.

Author:	Silicone_Milk [ 10-16-2006 02:12 PM ]
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Original Doom was the best. I still play it on a rainy day.

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Classic Doom better than New Doom................ https://www.quake3world.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=25327	Page 1 of 2

Author:	Captain [ 10-16-2006 02:20 PM ]
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scourge34 wrote: Other than the common idea, I consider them different games. I like both, with a lean towards the classic dooms. Aye, but Doom 3 still holds the fart as my favorite FPS game. EDIT: "fort"

Author:	Mat Linnett [ 10-16-2006 02:58 PM ]
Post subject:
I really enjoyed Doom 3, but classic Doom has stood the test of time, and I don't know if Doom 3 will, especially with community support being as weak as it is. The flash light was a good gameplay device, no matter what anybody tells you, but the focus on smaller amounts of enemies took something away from the game. Having to reload weapons in single player was a bag o' shite, meaning you couldn't get that special Doom rythm going. But darkness and light was great. Monster closets and "BOO!" style scares were poorly executed, especially when compared to similar tricks used in classic Doom. With decent map design, you should be able to bring Doom's tricks and traps into a modern game (after all, Quake did it), but sliding doors became the order of the day. I don't know, you could spend a long time picking holes in Doom 3, but the truth is, it's not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. It's just not classic Doom. What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake. The Shambler needs some lovin'.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-16-2006 03:26 PM ]
Post subject:
Mat Linnett wrote: What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake.The Shambler needs some lovin'. i thought Quake 4 WAS a follow up to the original quake? i duno like im completely ignorant of that subject seeing as i dont have quake 4 and have never played it

Author:	Scourge [ 10-16-2006 03:27 PM ]
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Mat Linnett wrote: I really enjoyed Doom 3, but classic Doom has stood the test of time, and I don't know if Doom 3 will, especially with community support being as weak as it is. The flash light was a good gameplay device, no matter what anybody tells you, but the focus on smaller amounts of enemies took something away from the game. Having to reload weapons in single player was a bag o' shite, meaning you couldn't get that special Doom rythm going. But darkness and light was great. Monster closets and "BOO!" style scares were poorly executed, especially when compared to similar tricks used in classic Doom. With decent map design, you should be able to bring Doom's tricks and traps into a modern game (after all, Quake did it), but sliding doors became the order of the day. I don't know, you could spend a long time picking holes in Doom 3, but the truth is, it's not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. It's just not classic Doom. What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake. The Shambler needs some lovin'. This I completely agree with.

Author:	Scourge [ 10-16-2006 03:28 PM ]
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the_roach/citizen_kane wrote: Mat Linnett wrote: What we REALLY need is a follow up to original Quake.The Shambler needs some lovin'. i thought Quake 4 WAS a follow up to the original quake? i duno like im completely ignorant of that subject seeing as i dont have quake 4 and have never played it No, it was a follow up to Quake 2. Completely different world and storyline. Quake 1 & 2 had nothing to do with eachother.

Author:	o'dium [ 10-16-2006 03:36 PM ]
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Pre D3 release - Damn, this may be good! After D3 release - Fuck... Wish they remake Quake One instead... The problem with D3 is that while its all looks, its NOTHING in game play. Yeah, some, of the things worked no matter what the masses say, but FFS... Monster Closits? How many Zombies would REALLY hide in a 2x2 square gap in a wall that shouldn't even be there? Monster closits are what made D3 awful. I mean, if they wanted to scare you, or ambush you, they didn't need them like that? And they didn't need to make them teleport in either? More Resident Evil scares please. I never once walked down a corridor with a window on my left and had a creature jump through it. I never once walked up to a door and as I walked through, had a zombie grab me... It just seemed so... I dunno, old school...? It just bought nothing new to the table apart from looks? I mean it was good, but nothing amazing? Its like id software are just scared to do anything TOO DIFFERENT so they stick to what they know best and that is classic FPS game play. To be fair, even Riddick was more scarey than Doom at times, and that was a SciFi shooter, not a horror game. (Which, BTW, takes my place as not only the best last gen looking game, but also the best FPS of that gen). I just feel its time for a complete overhaul... Riddick was great. I could jusmp and grab stuff, sneak about etc. In Doom, even in true Pitch Black, I couldn't hide from things. How cool would it of been to hide from monsters?

Author:	Scourge [ 10-16-2006 03:49 PM ]
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Exactly. Wasn't the best, wasn't the worst. To be fair with the darkness thing, they were demons and the like. They're supposed to be at home in the dark. You're supposed to be the one out of place.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-16-2006 03:50 PM ]
Post subject:
the classic Doom games have this timeless quality that seems to have been replaced in Doom3 by shameless pretension and hollywood-esque melodrama. its just the theatrics of it all is what kinda pisses me off, u know? like with the original game the storlyine was narrated very sparesly which meant that the player's interpretation of the story and what was going on was left laregly up to his own imagination. but the new game isnt like that at all, its just like yet another scifi shoot em up game thats just lost its edge. what a waste, cos the graphics are admitedly great and there was a few times when i really genuinely felt scared...but there was just a hell of a lot more of those times when i played classic Doom.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-16-2006 03:54 PM ]
Post subject:
scourge34 wrote: No, it was a follow up to Quake 2. Completely different world and storyline. Quake 1 & 2 had nothing to do with eachother. ah right, cool thanks for clearing that up. thing is, ive never played quake 2 either

Author:	MKJ [ 10-17-2006 02:59 AM ]
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agreed, mat. Romero had great ideas for both Wolf and Doom, and all of those ideas were shot down by Carmack because they were techincally impossible. well such excuses might work when youre no1 in the genre, but nowadays its just a sign of unwillingness, IMO.

Author:	o'dium [ 10-18-2006 04:00 AM ]
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Commander Keen was old school fun, and it worked. Theres a "low poly" thread on Polycount, and [DLS]Merskum made a low poly version of keen... And this REALLY makes me want to see a "REBirth" on the NDS or something, because that would ROCK:

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-19-2006 12:08 PM ]
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"apparently there existed a mysterious 11th Spht Clan that went into hiding and survived the Phfor invasion. im sending you down to Lhwon to take a look around" - Durandal memories.....

Author:	Scourge [ 11-17-2006 09:44 PM ]
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See: [lvlshot]http://www.jwivie.com/gurus.jpg[/lvlshot]

Author:	Scourge [ 10-16-2006 03:56 PM ]
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the_roach/citizen_kane wrote: scourge34 wrote: No, it was a follow up to Quake 2. Completely different world and storyline. Quake 1 & 2 had nothing to do with eachother. thing is, ive never played quake 2 either Heathen.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-16-2006 04:00 PM ]
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haha, yeah. altho i am on a mac and its just really hard to find that game for os X.

Author:	o'dium [ 10-16-2006 04:33 PM ]
Post subject:
Quake 2 was better than Quake 1 for me... But damn, why did they make Quake 4 into the generic sci fi wankfest it was Quake 2 had a certain style and atmosphere and they turned it into a Halo/Unreal Tourney cross over I mean no Females, Lava, Acid or Water out the box? What? Pretty much every level had some form of liquid in it!

Author:	Mat Linnett [ 10-17-2006 02:29 AM ]
Post subject:
See personally, I thought Quake 2's story was generic sci-fi; it didn't have any of the supernatural cyberhell stuff we'd come to associate with id, which both Doom and Quake did exceptionally well. I can't help but think that when they lost Romero, they lost that edge. I know, I know, what Romero's done since has been pretty useless and aimless too, but I think id with Romero was greater than the sum of it's parts.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-17-2006 06:07 AM ]
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o'dium wrote: But damn, why did they make Quake 4 into the generic sci fi wankfest it was Quake 2 had a certain style and atmosphere and they turned it into a Halo/Unreal Tourney cross over yeah that kinda sums up the way i feel about the new doom game, just replace the words Quake 4 and Quake 2 with Doom 3 and Classic Doom respectively... ps i heard theyre remaking commander keen and its meant to be simultaneously the most terrifying and most hilarious game ever created

Author:	4days [ 10-17-2006 06:27 AM ]
Post subject:
the classic doom mod for d3 is great. i know it would've been seen as a bit of a cop-out, but i wish that'd been the commercial game. as soon as it starts off and you hear the excellent instrumental remashing that sonicclang put together and see the old corridors vamped up in glistening 3d, it's like an idealised memory or something - great stuff.

Author:	Scourge [ 10-17-2006 06:32 AM ]
Post subject:
4days wrote: the classic doom mod for d3 is great. i know it would've been seen as a bit of a cop-out, but i wish that'd been the commercial game. as soon as it starts off and you hear the excellent instrumental remashing that sonicclang put together and see the old corridors vamped up in glistening 3d, it's like an idealised memory or something - great stuff. I wish they could have done all the episodes though. That would have been the icing on the cake. I do appreciate what they did do at any rate.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-17-2006 06:36 AM ]
Post subject:
scourge34 wrote: I wish they could have done all the episodes though. That would have been the icing on the cake. I do appreciate what they did do at any rate. theres doom 3 map editors isnt there? im sure someone will remake the other episodes in time....assuming that wont infringe on any copyrights....which it almost certainly will, hah

Author:	Scourge [ 10-17-2006 06:40 AM ]
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the_roach/citizen_kane wrote: scourge34 wrote: I wish they could have done all the episodes though. That would have been the icing on the cake. I do appreciate what they did do at any rate. theres doom 3 map editors isnt there? im sure someone will remake the other episodes in time....assuming that wont infringe on any copyrights....which it almost certainly will, hah Yes, there's an editor built into the game. And if you do all the construction yourself from scratch, then it's legal. I've been mapping since the original DOOM, but that would be just too much work with my limited amount of time.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-17-2006 07:03 AM ]
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hhm interesting. im a law student so naturally most of my time is spent sitting on my sofa at home watching daytime tv game shows like Countdown and Deal or No Deal...so time isnt an issue for me. but what is an issue is that ive never made a map for doom, ever... i was into making maps and scenarios for Marathon, i just thought it was cooler. hah dont ask , i duno

Author:	MKJ [ 10-17-2006 07:51 AM ]
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dont fret, marathon owned. i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac. i never really got into radiant though (whilst I tried, a lot), and D3 just doesnt do it for me, so mapping for it wont be happening. sigh, the memories

Author:	Captain [ 10-17-2006 08:03 AM ]
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the_roach/citizen_kane wrote: ps i heard theyre remaking commander keen and its meant to be simultaneously the most terrifying and most hilarious game ever created My brother has been the lead designer of a major, international Keen project for a few years now.

Author:	CitizenKane [ 10-17-2006 08:27 AM ]
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oh really? hah i was only joking. thats pretty cool tho. also: MKJ wrote: dont fret, marathon owned. yes, yes it did. id say the Phfor could kick the shit out of any puny satanic demon that tried to get in their way

Author:	hemostick [ 10-18-2006 03:55 AM ]
Post subject:
I didn't really like the cheap closet part of D3 like many people here but found myself much more pleased with the expansion. MKJ wrote: dont fret, marathon owned. i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac. I played marathon:infinity. pretty nice, although the sound of dying pfhors was quite ridiculous :P . Hellmaker ? I used macDEU+macBSP While Hellmaker was certainly friendlier (and actually had a grid to snap to... my textures were NEVER aligned in macDEU ), I liked the ability to mess around inside wads that *DEU provided.

Author:	Scourge [ 10-18-2006 04:54 AM ]
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I mostly used WadEd for DOOM. sometimes EdMap. Radiant for Q2&3. Haven't really messed with Q4 or D3 too much, but the little I have done has been with the ingame editors. Of course there was Build for Duke3d and Blood.

Author:	MKJ [ 10-18-2006 06:27 AM ]
Post subject:
hemostick wrote: I didn't really like the cheap closet part of D3 like many people here but found myself much more pleased with the expansion. MKJ wrote: dont fret, marathon owned. i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac. I played marathon:infinity. pretty nice, although the sound of dying pfhors was quite ridiculous :P . Hellmaker ? I used macDEU+macBSP While Hellmaker was certainly friendlier (and actually had a grid to snap to... my textures were NEVER aligned in macDEU ), I liked the ability to mess around inside wads that *DEU provided. aye, I made a mod once for Doom but that was with an app other than DEU.. something like WadHak or something? cant remember the mod owned though, dubbed Rebel Imp, where the player was an imp and you had to fight using only fireballs and scratches

Author:	Scourge [ 11-17-2006 09:36 PM ]
Post subject:
MKJ wrote: hemostick wrote: I didn't really like the cheap closet part of D3 like many people here but found myself much more pleased with the expansion. MKJ wrote: dont fret, marathon owned. i used to map a lot for Doom with Hellmaker, fucking great Doom editor for mac. I played marathon:infinity. pretty nice, although the sound of dying pfhors was quite ridiculous :P . Hellmaker ? I used macDEU+macBSP While Hellmaker was certainly friendlier (and actually had a grid to snap to... my textures were NEVER aligned in macDEU ), I liked the ability to mess around inside wads that *DEU provided. aye, I made a mod once for Doom but that was with an app other than DEU.. something like WadHak or something? cant remember the mod owned though, dubbed Rebel Imp, where the player was an imp and you had to fight using only fireballs and scratches I've still got all those old editors on a disc. Tricks of the DOOM Gurus cd had all that stuff, plus I still have my old D!Zone disc. Also the H!Zone disc for Heretic and Hexen.

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