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Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 374
PostPosted: 01-03-2021 10:57 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Something that might be of interest to a few folks here:
http://thamessoftware.co.uk/openradiant.html




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This is not Æon!
This is not Æon!
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 2182
PostPosted: 01-06-2021 06:43 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I have waited a long time for someone to take the gtkcode and start working out things, I hope this can deliver in the future.



_________________
Q3Map2 2516 -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/q3map_2.5.16_win32_x86.zip
Q3Map2 FS_20g -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/q3map2_fs_20g.rar
GtkRadiant 140 -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/GtkRadiantSetup-1.4.0-Q3RTCWET.exe


Last edited by Hipshot on 01-06-2021 06:53 AM, edited 1 time in total.

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This is not Æon!
This is not Æon!
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 2182
PostPosted: 01-06-2021 06:53 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I already have issues, I should mail them.

* Can't change grid with the numpad keys.
* the x/y 2d view disappears behind the "base view" when you click in on a menu, in free layout mode.
* Pressing Q shows no detailed brush size information, just the lines around the brush, but no text (not sure where I see the brush size info w/o this to be honest =)).



_________________
Q3Map2 2516 -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/q3map_2.5.16_win32_x86.zip
Q3Map2 FS_20g -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/q3map2_fs_20g.rar
GtkRadiant 140 -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/GtkRadiantSetup-1.4.0-Q3RTCWET.exe


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Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 374
PostPosted: 01-07-2021 11:28 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Indeed, it seems a bit rough so far.

In other news NetRadiant-custom has had a major update: https://github.com/Garux/netradiant-custom




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This is not Æon!
This is not Æon!
Joined: 20 Jan 2002
Posts: 2182
PostPosted: 01-07-2021 11:35 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


My biggest gripe with all these radiant versions are that they are not "synced" to what's good. Difficult to explain, but gtk 1.6 has good stuff in it, but fails on some obscure areas like the layout things for me, it just doesn't work as well as 1.4.

Openradiant seems to have a bunch of good stuff, but then misses some other things, like that with the viewport, I can't use that editor with such an error because I use a very specific setup when I edit. Anyway, I mailed then and got a lenghty reply back, so that was nice, I can pitch ideas directly to them and see where it lands.

I think radiants bigguest issue is that the good versions are "gtk", or the OLD qe-version. Someone should just make a regular windows standard version and fix things like a wasd movement in the viewport, use a normal file handler etc =D



_________________
Q3Map2 2516 -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/q3map_2.5.16_win32_x86.zip
Q3Map2 FS_20g -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/q3map2_fs_20g.rar
GtkRadiant 140 -> http://www.zfight.com/misc/files/q3/GtkRadiantSetup-1.4.0-Q3RTCWET.exe


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Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Posts: 390
PostPosted: 01-08-2021 06:02 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I always thought interesting features to add to Radiant would be support for IES Light Profiles and a physically accurate black-body radiation temperature scale, where instead of trying to find a RGB value for a light source you could just type in a Kelvin temperature and it automatically converts it into the corresponding RGB values. IES profiles would probably require a new version of q3map2 though (access to the lightmap textures to be able to modify them), whereas blackbody temperatures can be internally converted by Radiant behind-the-scenes before compile time.



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EmeraldProductions
http://emeraldproductions.weebly.com/index.html


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I'm the dude!
I'm the dude!
Joined: 04 Feb 2002
Posts: 12446
PostPosted: 01-11-2021 08:45 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Hipshot wrote:
My biggest gripe with all these radiant versions are that they are not "synced" to what's good.


That's a product of open source software by design. You can easily branch out the source and make your own deviant with new features, sometimes those features get fed back to the master, but sometimes they don't. They're like a bunch of experimental projects and the better ones float, the lesser ones sink. The problem with Radiant is that the community is shrinking and so are the number of developers, so you'll see plenty of side projects but it doesn't quite have the critical mass needed to really push along the major projects. Better collaboration could potentially help. Also, what's "good" is often subjective, there are pretty staunch defenders of all the major derivatives and their implementations.

The general code base between 1.4/1.6 and 1.5/NetRadiant is profoundly different. Not sure what OpenRadiant is based on (looks like an older branch of 1.6?).



_________________
GtkRadiant | Q3Map2 | Shader Manual


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Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 374
PostPosted: 01-15-2021 07:58 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It is a matter of pros and cons indeed, but I think Gtk still comes on top despite the many problems with it.

For instance, since switching to a new PC last year I can't select multiple brush faces. Well I can by holding and hovering, but when I try to click to select another face, the other face(s) deselect - super annoying. I can't be the only one with this problem?

I'd love to fix a few of the issues but it's a massive pain trying to build the source since the libraries are all fucky.

Anyone tried Trenchbroom yet? Still not convinced by it personally.




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Recruit
Recruit
Joined: 16 Dec 2020
Posts: 7
PostPosted: 02-28-2021 06:37 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Im wondering, what are your issues with the Garux NetRadiant specifically? I find that it's highly customizable and doesn't lack anything that earlier versions had that I know of. Most importantly, it's actively developed and open source, so if there is anything you're missing in that version you can bring it up. Garux already implemented a few features or fixed issues I brought up.

It's hard to imagine someone would prefer an older version for Quake 3 mapping given all those incredible improvements and quality of life upgrades.
See feature showcase to get an idea: https://garux.github.io/NRC/

On a slightly related note, talking about new tools, check out this amazing Blender tool that lets you import and edit BSP files. You can edit vertex normals, vertex colors/alpha, texture coordinates, entities, and most notably, you can bake lightmaps in Blender. (internal and external lightmaps)
It's still somewhat early in development but can be very useful.



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id Tech 3 Mapping Trello


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Insane Quaker
Insane Quaker
Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 374
PostPosted: 03-01-2021 02:43 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I wanted to move over to netradiant-custom... I really did. It has impressive productivity features and fixes loads of bugs. I just can't get a handle of the controls, and after asking Garux for a Gtk-style prefab he declined (https://github.com/Garux/netradiant-custom/issues/61). So the majority of my level editing is still done in Gtk for now.

There's something about mapping in modelling software makes me uncomfortable! Interesting though.




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Recruit
Recruit
Joined: 16 Dec 2020
Posts: 7
PostPosted: 03-02-2021 01:07 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It's been ages since I used GTK because i couldnt even get it running on Windows 10. It sounds like there are few very specific differences that are lost in netradiant, but at the same time, i think you gain a whole lot more new functionality. Some of them can probably be worked around.
e.g. The entity rotation thing. I have bound alt+y/x/z to rotate the selection 90° on the respective axis. That's much faster than clicking buttons. I initially really missed these toolbar buttons too, until i found the keybind.
So even when some features are missing, I think in many cases you can replace it with new features or find it in the keybinds. Make sure to go through the keybind list under edit > shortcuts. Minimizing toolbar use (clicking) is a good thing!

One of my most used features that I wouldnt want to trade for anything is being able to move/center the camera and 3d views to my selection. That saves me more time than anything. (CameraFocusOnSelected and XYFocusOnSelected in keybinds) Navigation as a whole is just improved so much.
Even coming from the original NetRadiant, it still took me at least two weeks to get somewhat used to, and most of all, configure this new Radiant. But once you start discovering all the keybinds and features, it's probably an easy tradeoff to take.



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id Tech 3 Mapping Trello


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