This fucking scares me...

[R00k]

It's a good reason for irresponsible people to stop storing guns in their homes.

[Nightshade]

Individuals reporting wildly improbable gun use seems to be a feature of most of the small sample size (order of 10E3) studies. The authors of that study are pretty honest about what it does to their figures; but it's noteworthy that they point out that the difference depending on the number of loons you include (and how did they get their hands on firearms anyway? *gulp*) is orders of magnitude; which is why the victimization study's figures may be more accurate than the NRA's. It's pertinent to the original point of this thread, which is the need to (as I interpret the legalese) be seen to have attempted to avoid conflict before using potentially deadly force, especially as judicial opinion seems to be that, a lot of the time, people are doing so illegally.

Ok, in the figures that have been posted here, I've seen one reference to a person claiming wildly improbable gun use. This is not indicative of a trend, not by any means. And you still have not answered my question about the sample size of your cited survey wherein three people reported 58% of the gun usage in the survey. And again, I do not only reference the NRA's cited numbers(Kleck et al), but also the 13 other surveys on the GunCite page.
The point of the beginning of this thread was a pending law allowing you to employ deadly force if threatened with same. Judicial opinion in this case appears to be three judges (most likely well qualifiied to make such observations I grant you) looking at what looks to be a highly flawed survey with a microscopic sample size.

The "can of worms" thing was just that I was expecting the usual right wing loony gags to come out given that that seems to be what most of the militias are (we have the same thing in the UK: it's called the BNP).

Hey, I think a lot of them are wackos, too. Not, however, because they choose to arm themselves against potential governmental tyranny. See the Randy Weaver and Branch Davidian cases and you'll catch my meaning.

To be honest, though, from going through the figures it's looking more and more like the gun suicide rate is a good reason for preventing people from storing guns in their own house :icon32:

Suicidal people are die because they want to, not because a gun jumped up and shot them. I think that gun suicide figures should be omitted from these debates altogether.

[R00k]

I think the suicides should be removed from the debate also, unless it is an accidental suicide. i.e. the kid wouldn't have killed himself at all, except he found a gun, bumped a trigger, and got shot.
Remember, pill overdoses make suicide just as easy and painless as a gun, and they're just as trendy for the angst-ridden.

[losCHUNK]

heh, if i was gunna off myself i wouldnt have the balls to jump off a cliff or throw a knife through my wrist

[Nightshade]

Suicidal people are die because they want to, not because a gun jumped up and shot them. I think that gun suicide figures should be omitted from these debates altogether.

I don't. I think it's entirely possible to be suicidal, yet still shit scared of dying. At least in any kind of slow and painful way. Plenty of people slash and drug themselves in a moment's thought. There's no chance to think twice and no rehab for being head shot (arf)

I strongly disagree. If you want to kill yourself, you will. It's not the method that pushes you to do it. My mom's worked in the mental health field for 25 years, and in that time she's seen plenty of folks end up offing themselves. The ones that take some pills or make half-assed slashes at their wrists don't want to die, they want help. The ones that take their lives don't make a huge production, they just do it.

[R00k]

heh, if i was gunna off myself i wouldnt have the balls to jump off a cliff or throw a knife through my wrist

http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net ... ly_suicide

[Nightshade]

heh, if i was gunna off myself i wouldnt have the balls to jump off a cliff or throw a knife through my wrist

Takes just as much sack to pull the trigger.

IT IS A HARD HEART THAT KILLS.

[R00k]

Yea, I don't really understand when people talk about how easy it is to kill yourself with a gun.

It takes monumental willpower to even hold an empty one to your head, or point it anywhere near yourself intentionally.

[HM-PuFFNSTuFF]

Yea, I don't really understand when people talk about how easy it is to kill yourself with a gun.

It takes monumental willpower to even hold an empty one to your head, or point it anywhere near yourself intentionally.

if you factor the role of alcohol into the equation i think you might understand why it's an issue.

in fact the role of alcohol use in gun crime is also a huge issue

[+JuggerNaut+]

Yea, I don't really understand when people talk about how easy it is to kill yourself with a gun.

exactly. how is someone supposed to know "how easy it is" unless they're mentally unstable themselves?

[Dukester]

maybe we can outlaw alcohol while we are outlawing guns!

[losCHUNK]

if they outlawd alcohol id top myself

thats reason enough not to do it

[Dukester]

heh, they tried it here once, it was such a HUGE success!

[Nightshade]

Yea, I don't really understand when people talk about how easy it is to kill yourself with a gun.

It takes monumental willpower to even hold an empty one to your head, or point it anywhere near yourself intentionally.

if you factor the role of alcohol into the equation i think you might understand why it's an issue.

in fact the role of alcohol use in gun crime is also a huge issue

The use of alcohol in ALL forms of crime is a huge issue. Especially domestic violence, far more cases of that every year than gun crime, I'd imagine.

[shaft]

*yawn*

[HM-PuFFNSTuFF]

cunt

[seremtan]

so, are more floridians getting shot or not?

someone should warn YourKalashnipa

[I cant spell u]

I was shot the other day

[R00k]

someone should warn YourKalashnipa

[R00k]

*yawn*

Hey, this is a reefsurfer thread.