New Q3 coming

[Bueller]

Found this article on esreality today. Looks promising for those of us that love Q3.

Many people have been talking about Q3 and what a great game it was. But the engine is old and pales in comparision to engines such as the u2 and up and coming u3 engine. This open source engine addresses some of the features that people would like to see with an updated engine. Now you can have a look for yourself. The guys over at icculus have started work on an updated Q3 engine. With things like added openAL we're starting to see the changes in Q4 on the Q3 engine. Could this be the engine that everyone expected Q4 to be? It looks promising and some of the features are really nice. Check it out, it is mod compatible but obviously not with PB as it is a new engine.

http://icculus.org/quake3/?page=home

[a13n]

So it always comes down to hardware requirements, doesn't it? :icon6:
I need no more stress on my poor environment. :icon7:

[^misantropia^]

a13n> it has the same requirements as (and is fully compatible with) the 1.32 PR, sans PB and a ton of bugs.

[dzjepp]

Yeah, too bad pb prevents us from enjoying icculus on all the currently populated q3 servers. :<

[[xeno]Julios]

isn't there a way to have the best of both worlds?

i.e. pb + icculus?

why are people blaming pb?

from what i understand, pb is quite effective, and it's server admins who are at fault when they configure pb in retarded ways.

[DooMer]

icculus is a new exe, and will never work with pb.

[CheapAlert]

Found this article on esreality today. Looks promising for those of us that love Q3.

Many people have been talking about Q3 and what a great game it was. But the engine is old and pales in comparision to engines such as the u2 and up and coming u3 engine. This open source engine addresses some of the features that people would like to see with an updated engine. Now you can have a look for yourself. The guys over at icculus have started work on an updated Q3 engine. With things like added openAL we're starting to see the changes in Q4 on the Q3 engine. Could this be the engine that everyone expected Q4 to be? It looks promising and some of the features are really nice. Check it out, it is mod compatible but obviously not with PB as it is a new engine.

http://icculus.org/quake3/?page=home

it's called xreal.

[dzjepp]

icculus is a new exe, and will never work with pb.

yeah, what he said

[Bueller]

Found this article on esreality today. Looks promising for those of us that love Q3.

Many people have been talking about Q3 and what a great game it was. But the engine is old and pales in comparision to engines such as the u2 and up and coming u3 engine. This open source engine addresses some of the features that people would like to see with an updated engine. Now you can have a look for yourself. The guys over at icculus have started work on an updated Q3 engine. With things like added openAL we're starting to see the changes in Q4 on the Q3 engine. Could this be the engine that everyone expected Q4 to be? It looks promising and some of the features are really nice. Check it out, it is mod compatible but obviously not with PB as it is a new engine.

http://icculus.org/quake3/?page=home

it's called xreal.

Thx for the info. Lokks pretty cool. Wonder how far off they are? Heres a link: http://xreal.sourceforge.net/xrealwiki

[a13n]

a13n> it has the same requirements as (and is fully compatible with) the 1.32 PR, sans PB and a ton of bugs.

Yes, at the moment but near future...

[S@M]

it will still not be pb compatible... in the near future...

[busetibi]

it will still not be pb compatible... in the near future...

makes no difference, you'll never find a server in oz

[[xeno]Julios]

icculus is a new exe, and will never work with pb.

why?

and again, i sense irrational prejudice against pb.

[[xeno]Julios]

because punkbuster functionality is built into the exe. your assumptions are baseless.

what assumptions? I'm asking questions trying to learn here.

why can't pb functionality be built into the icculus exe?

[^misantropia^]

why?

PB intrinsically relies on its encapsulating software being closed source, which is fully incompatible with the GPL'ed Q3A source. Separating PB into its own DLL isn't a solution either since the host executable needs code to load said DLL and call its functions. And what is to stop a cheater from compiling an executable without that code?

[[xeno]Julios]

PB intrinsically relies on its encapsulating software being closed source, which is fully incompatible with the GPL'ed Q3A source.

ic - that makes sense to me. But didn't they already release the q3 source code?

Separating PB into its own DLL isn't a solution either since the host executable needs code to load said DLL and call its functions. And what is to stop a cheater from compiling an executable without that code?

But this cheater wouldn't be able to play on pure servers would she?

[Lenard]

The whole thing is that this mod necessitates the use of a modified .exe and pb absolutely under no circumstances will work with a modified exe.

[[xeno]Julios]

The whole thing is that this mod necessitates the use of a modified .exe and pb absolutely under no circumstances will work with a modified exe.

well pb worked with earlier versions of quake3 - the quake3 was modified since and pb was updated to be able to work.

[^misantropia^]

But didn't they already release the q3 source code?

Only the SDK, the part you need to create mods. The engine itself was closed source until recently.

[[xeno]Julios]

ok why not go the dll route, and incorporate a pure check into the icculus exe?

you could make the pure such that it allowed the icculus quake3.exe and the id quake3.exe

[Foo]

ok why not go the dll route, and incorporate a pure check into the icculus exe?

you could make the pure such that it allowed the icculus quake3.exe and the id quake3.exe

Punkbuster doesn't work on the basis of pure systems. it works by calculating an MD5 hash of the .exe itself.

Different exe, different hash.

icculus could be accomodated, if PB were updated to reflect it. I seriously doubt this falls within the contract between id and evenbalance.

[[xeno]Julios]

Punkbuster doesn't work on the basis of pure systems. it works by calculating an MD5 hash of the .exe itself.

Different exe, different hash.

my suggestion was in response to this post:

why?

Separating PB into its own DLL isn't a solution either since the host executable needs code to load said DLL and call its functions. And what is to stop a cheater from compiling an executable without that code?

icculus could be accomodated, if PB were updated to reflect it. I seriously doubt this falls within the contract between id and evenbalance.

well has anyone even bothered to approach evenbalance?

seems like we have a bit of a rift in the community here - there's no logical reason why pb and icculus couldn't work together is there?

they both serve a vital function - no need for them to remain mutually exclusive.

[Foo]

If the Q3 exe and punkbuster could be seperated into seperate files without losing the main purpose of PB, then it would be a possibility.

You can't have an open source engine and a closed source anticheat wrapped in the same .exe file

[Lenard]

The whole thing is that this mod necessitates the use of a modified .exe and pb absolutely under no circumstances will work with a modified exe.

well pb worked with earlier versions of quake3 - the quake3 was modified since and pb was updated to be able to work.

Punkbuster was also updated for each version moslty through autodl's I thinks.

[Caffeine]

all of the punkbuster code was removed from the executable source before 1.32 was released open-source. Remains a mystery

What's the mystery? If PB were open source, then people would more easily be able to work around it.

once icculus were finished

"icculus" is a person: Ryan Gordon, who's mostly known for his contract work at Epic Games and his Mac/Linux ports. icculus.org is his domain.

In fact, Ryan hasn't done too much with ioQ3 beyond providing web hosting and a subversion repository for it. Tim "Timbo" Angus and Ludwig Nussel are the ones who actually made a lot of changes to the codebase.

I dont see why they couldn't contact id/activision and say "HEY WE FIXXORED YOUR BROKEN ENGINE

ioQ3 still has bugs and a number of features that remain unimplemented (e.g. IPv6 support). Who's to say when it will be "finished," if ever?

CAN YOU NOW CHEATER-PROOF IT FOR US?"

Punk Buster is not and never will be "cheater-proof." It is difficult to circumvent (on Windows, anyways), but not impossible for determined cheaters.