Does anyone have the same Q with this?

Post by **a13n** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:17 am

Why does not radiant csg-subtract with bounding box before acutally subtracting?
At least it should provide us a toggle button.

Post by **spookmineer** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:08 pm

CSG subtract is a sometimes buggy way to shape brushes with, which is why most mappers stay away from it :/

Post by **Oeloe** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:23 am

Now that the radiant source is out, perhaps csg substract is a thing that can be fixed. Dreaming on... :icon26:

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:30 am

I'll post a ref pic soon for you.

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:50 am

pic uploaded(2d)

Post by **Shallow** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:35 am

As with the majority of your rather bizarre questions, the answer is "Because it was never coded that way".

In your example it would still make a messy set of cuts with a bunch more brushes than were needed resulting in wasted triangles, and probably unseen faces being drawn etc.

It's a sucky tool and always will be.

Post by **Foo** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:55 am

Useful for one purpose and one purpose only here, to chop and entire side off a complex brush when I need to buff it up against a wall.

And even then, I make sure there's only 2 brushes in the region before I do it.

Post by **Fjoggs** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 10:11 am

I've never ever used csg subtract. I'm a saint.

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:41 pm

@Shallow
At least a pre-subtraction by this bounding box will help some manipulation afterwards.

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:43 pm

Fjoggs wrote:I've never ever used csg subtract. I'm a saint.

I don't really get it.
Even in real life subtraction is essential to form some shapes and end results are alos messy.

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:46 pm

Shallow wrote:As with the majority of your rather bizarre questions, the answer is "Because it was never coded that way".

So is it easy to grab the bounding box of the selected brush and do one more additional pre-subtraction?

Post by **Foo** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:03 pm

Fjoggs wrote:I've never ever used csg subtract. I'm a saint.

hah, I tainted your map. I used it a few times when I was messing with that vis stuff.

Post by **obsidian** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:09 pm

I don't think there is a true clever way of writing some sort of subtraction algorithm. Even in 3D modeling apps, subtraction operations always result in a polygonal mess to clean up afterwards.

Anyway, just use the clipper. Easy, fast and clean!

Post by **4days** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:30 pm

brush subtraction in quark is really good, if you can be bothered to use another app for the sake of one feature.

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:35 pm

4days wrote:brush subtraction in quark is really good, if you can be bothered to use another app for the sake of one feature.

Like what?

Post by **Fjoggs** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:47 pm

Foo wrote:
Fjoggs wrote:I've never ever used csg subtract. I'm a saint.
hah, I tainted your map. I used it a few times when I was messing with that vis stuff.

NO WAI!!?!?!

Post by **4days** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:53 pm

a13n wrote:
4days wrote:brush subtraction in quark is really good, if you can be bothered to use another app for the sake of one feature.
Like what?

i don't understand what you're asking.

brush subtraction in quark is done in the way you describe, a bounding box is created around the 'cutter' brush and creates a new set of brushes - more often than not, this gives an efficient result that doesn't need too much work to tidy up afterwards.

Post by **a13n** » Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:56 pm

Oh, really?
I've never used quirk becuase I am a saint, purist and Qristian.
As it were, a policy not to have an ex-editor.

Post by **wattro** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:47 am

Actually i really like csg-subtract...

As long as you understand how it's going to impact your map, you can use it whenever it's advantageous to do so (particularly as Foo mentions, to chop sides off complex brushes).

Sometimes if you are quick with clipping and merging, it's easier to go in and fix the errors that csg-subtract creates than it is to destroy and create a number of new brushes.

Post by **Kat** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:56 am

So you guys don't use/do any 2 or 3 point clipping?!

Post by **wattro** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 5:33 am

not to speak for others, but of course we do use 2 and 3-point clipping...

just that we are not restricted to it and i find the csg-subtract tool is not evil, as suggested by a few individuals, but in fact, an excellent tool that helps me make my crappy maps

/showing some love for Edge Manipulation and Vertex Editing

Post by **obsidian** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 3:56 pm

Subtract has its merits, but they are few and far between.

You have to be 'gentle' when using edge and especially vertex editing to make sure you don't break any brushes.

Clipping of course is where it's at. Patchclipping FTW, for anyone who has never tried it!

Post by **a13n** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 8:36 am

obsidian wrote:Patchclipping FTW, for anyone who has never tried it!

Curved patch does not work as intended.