New mouse

[AmIdYfReAk]

mx500 is still the best, unless ur a moron.

http://www.esreality.com/?a=longpost&id=1265679&page=22

the silver is allmost all gone on mine.. Wont be changing it any time soon.

[[xeno]Julios]

I'm still kicking ass with this puppy:

[Turbine]

Welcome to prehistory.

[[xeno]Julios]

Welcome to prehistory.

the shape of the wingman offers a unique method of control - a three finger grip without constriction of the fingers. This allows for independent modulation of each finger, seamlessly interacting to form a dynamic unit of control.

Many other mice seem to force your three fingers together, which constricts their independence of one another.

The fatality 1010 and 2020 has a similar shape, but have hardware flaws from what I understand.

[Turbine]

Here is a good review of the Razer Death Adder. With Team Fortress 2 game play.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHIqL4poT2c

[AmIdYfReAk]

that is what pass's for a "good review" ?

[JulesWinnfield]

I have one of these.. I like it well enough.

http://www.rocketfishproducts.com/pc-84 ... mouse.aspx

I also recently had one of those Natural MS Ergonomic mice (6000 something). It was awful++. It was pretty uncomfortable even with my dainty small hands.

[Tsakali_]

Welcome to prehistory.

the shape of the wingman offers a unique method of control - a three finger grip without constriction of the fingers. This allows for independent modulation of each finger, seamlessly interacting to form a dynamic unit of control.

Many other mice seem to force your three fingers together, which constricts their independence of one another.

The fatality 1010 and 2020 has a similar shape, but have hardware flaws from what I understand.

hard to believe since the second and third fingers (counting from the pinky side)are connected in such a way that independent control of the two is somewhat uncomfortable if not down right impossible.

[[xeno]Julios]

hard to believe since the second and third fingers (counting from the pinky side)are connected in such a way that independent control of the two is somewhat uncomfortable if not down right impossible.

you mean the ring and middle fingers? Do you have problems flexing and extending those fingers independently of one another?

I would assume normally that this wouldn't be a problem, but i played musical instruments as a kid so maybe this assumption is wrong.

[scared?]

that wingman is still my favorite mouse of all time but it cramped my hands...and i couldn't live without scroll now...

[[xeno]Julios]

hard to believe since the second and third fingers (counting from the pinky side)are connected in such a way that independent control of the two is somewhat uncomfortable if not down right impossible.

it's hard to flex the middle finger all the way without the ring finger flexing slightly, but for the fine control that's involved in modulating the mouse, we're only talking about about 5 percent of the range of full flexion. Think about playing piano, or drumming your fingers - i'm sure you'd have no problem tapping out a rhyhtm which alternates the middle and ring finger.

[Tsakali_]

I must be especially restricted in that kind of movement, I am resting my hand on the muse and I try to pretend that I can click a 3rd button and it seems to take allot of (relative) effort for my ring finger.

it feels as if it would get sore after a game session

[[xeno]Julios]

ah yes the relative strength of the ring finger (and pinky) is small compared to the index and middle, which is why you'd want to assign something other than, say, firing, to the third button. (i use it to switch to lg, and i use middle mouse for crouch).

But by independent modulation, I mean you can actually control the movement of the mouse by slightly flexing and extending the fingers.

Here's an excerpt from a post I wrote a while back:

Grip is also crucial. I only have extensive experience with the wingman
gaming mouse, so take that into consideration. Depending on the style of
the mouse, and your own preference, you may choose to use either a two
finger (2f), or a three finger (3f) grip. A three finger grip allows for
more control, since you involve an extra group of muscles (fiver fingers
instead of four) to modulate the control of the mouse. However, a 2f
grip allows for a tighter control unit. To understand this, consider
that with a 2f grip, you can grip the side edges of the mouse with your
thumb on the left side, and the ring finger on the right side. With a 3f
grip, it's the thumb on the left side, and the pinky on the right. From
my own experience, it seems that the ring finger is stronger and better
coordinated than the pinky, and being able to control the sides of the
mouse with strength and coordination is an advantage when trying to
modulate the lateral velocity of the mouse. For instance, if you're
flicking to the right, you can use the muscles that are acting upon the
right side of the mouse to act as a braking force which can control the
movement and duration of the flick.

However, this advantage may be not as significant as it seems, and the
advantages of a 3f grip may outweigh this relative insignificance.

Unfortunately, many three button mice have the three buttons quite close
together, which cramps and restricts the fingers. The wingman (which is
essentially dead) allows for a 3f grip where all three fingers are in
relaxed position - with the same amount of spread as there'd be if you
were sleeping. Take this factor into consideration when choosing the grip.


Another important aspect of grip is the parts of your hand which are in
contact with the mouse. This is a function of the shape of the mouse
(flatter mice = less surface area in contact with palm, humped mice =
more), and the arch of your hand. You can increase the arch of your hand
by pivoting your hand upwards, around the wrist, and by flexing your
fingers (so that fingertips rotate toward palm).

Notice that if your entire hand is in contact with the mouse, it is
virtually impossible to use the metacarpal muscles to control the mouse.
A quick experiment will demonstrate this clearly:

Grasp your mouse so that your entire palm and all the length of the
fingers are in contact with the mouse. Now draw a circle on the screen
with your cursor (or a figure eight or whatever).

Now grasp the mouse with a curved arch so that only your finger tips are
in contact with the mouse, and draw the same figure. be sure to use your
metacarpal muscles to control the movement.

Notice the surgical precision?

Assuming a 3f grip, when you flex your middle three fingers, the cursor
moves down, and when you extend them, the cursor moves up. When you flex
your thumb, the mouse moves right (if thumb is positioned on left edge),
and when you flex your pinky, the mouse moves left.

Note that you now have five independent modulators which can seamlessly
interact with the mouse in order to produce a desired movement.

Some people prefer more surface area in contact with mouse (with much of
their palm in contact with mouse), because it provides a more stable and
rigid contact with the mouse from which to use the higher level muscle
groups, and it is more comfy; This would make sense if you didn't want
to use the metacarpal muscles at all, but if you do want to incorporate
them, you'll need a grip that compromises palm in favour of fingertips.
You must develop your own balance, and experiment.

see http://www.quake3world.com/forum/viewto ... &start=105 for full post.

[Tsakali_]

your quote reminds me of an instructional book for pianists I skimmed through the other day, I found it in my GF's collection, it goes into alot of detail of posture, arm position and proper usage of finger muscles.

[Kills On Site]

MX510s and MX518s (have both) are some of the best mice ever made.

[Cooldown]

So you never bought a new optical mouse julios? I know it can be hard to change mice (after using the same one for so long), but I would think you would adapt relatively quickly.