i was gonna clean it all up before i released it... its a beta... i do all that last when im done. i know ya not being mean or anything but while everything is still up in the air in terms of final textures etc. its still far from finished
credits have being sorted out etc... plz dont be offended, it really was not my intention.
Hipshot, i'll remove all ya textures so i can keep on ya good side... (your way to talented to annoy) gonna have to fire up photoshop and make some of my own custom textures
which is really what i should be doing anyway.
the final will be clean, tidy and with all the right credits etc.. im so sorry if i offended anyone by forgetting that i had not updated my txt file for a while.. my bad
heh, and yeah, i was using map packer from q3map2toolz
I didn't mean to come out so hard, please don't misunderstand.
Please use the textures, I'm just glad if people like them.
I really thought this was how it was supposed to look in the final version, espec since the reade said that you didn't find readmes for all textures used, etc. And also, even though it's a beta you still don't want to release it like this.
Some have complained about the lighting, even implying that Q3A maps *must* obey to some, apparently predefined (?) lighting protocol, but I disagree.
Of course, things *can* be taken too far, where you'd create some nausea and seizure inducing nightmare, but in my opinion that isn't the case here at all.
On the contrary; this is a map with a very unique, distinct look; More like a breath of fresh air than an 'abomination', and I applaud it.
Good work, fKd. I'll try to give some more constructive feedback later.
all the textures and paths have been fixed and all the credits have now been updated.. i think my new shader file goes even above and beyond what others have done....(credits in shader and txt) the wrong has been righted... i hope
things are starting to look better, a nice 10-14 hour stint fixing all sorts.
ok here is the next update i've fixed all the paths, desaturated a bunch of the textures and added heaps of new geometry.. i think its starting to hit the final stage...
feedback is handy as always. gameplay and aesthetic feedback esp.
again, thanks for all the help
Last edited by fKd on Sun Aug 02, 2009 2:25 am, edited 2 times in total.
There is enough detail in this map to make 2 maps! Its crazy some of the things you are doing with bolts, wires and pipes. There is a lot of cool visuals but first I want to talk about the gameplay and how it feels very flat and linear IMHO. Ive got a bunch of screenshots, so sit tight!
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image01.jpg[/lvlshot]
There is only one route up via a JP and you need more. On the left hand side next to the water, create some route up with jumps via pipes, wires or more consoles. On the right hand side you should be able to get across from the platform opposite the regen via jumps again. Dropping down to use the JP is too slow and predictable. Remove the ammo packs next to the SG, especially the RG ammo pack.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image02.jpg[/lvlshot]
I love the skybox with the dark city view below and clouds moving across the sky, shame you cannot see more of it. Cut out this space, create a mega window with a docking bay outside for ships to lands on, maybe crates/cargo to hint at how stuff gets to this floating place in the sky. Remove the rocks they dont fit the style of the place, cut the space away and put a crane system there, hint at how the cargo gets off the platform out of the window into the complex. Big tech crane with sections overhanging the atrium!
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image03.jpg[/lvlshot]
Remove the glass window to allow players to drop down or ramp jump up from the stairs below. Remove the GL ammo pack, you don't need to do this in Q3. (It seems to be a trait of Unreal) Shift the YA down to the ledge below and create a series of steps up to the ledge above on the left. Jumping route via pipes etc, nothing too direct but doable if being chased.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image04.jpg[/lvlshot]
Not sure how attached you are to the central area but it plays awkward to me. Lower the central platform down so you can jump to it from several different points around the place. When I run around this upper area with the GL I want to jump (difficult) to the central area and there is no routes, it is too linear.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image05.jpg[/lvlshot]
Remove RG ammo pack, move SG to ground floor and put the medi pack in the corner control room.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image06.jpg[/lvlshot]
I really don't like the RG in such a deathtrap dead end, it needs several ways in otherwise people will just camp there and annoy everyone. Cut the floor here and create drop down space for grenades! :P Let people flush out campers with some pineapples on the head. Maybe even a GL ammo pack so everyone gets the hint and kills the camper below.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image07.jpg[/lvlshot]
This area here would be a perfect space for a second route to the RG, cut it out and round under the existing stairs towards the RG. Not sure how attached you are with the water into the RG but I would suggest removing it and replacing it with awkward jumps out via pipes or crates. Approaching the RG area in water is certain death for anyone and campers paradise. I would highly recommend removing the shards+health next to the RG, it screams camp here and annoy everyone.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image08.jpg[/lvlshot]
Change the JP for a lift so if someone is chasing they have to choose the second route up or wait. The wall on the left, switch the fan unit to the floor, computer alcove to the top. Create a platform outwards and switch the large crate around to the front of the two smaller one's. So the alternative route up is hop, skip the crates, to the platform and then up to the top via steps or more jumps. Allow space underneath platform for another route. (see next screenshot)
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image09.jpg[/lvlshot]
Create a route underneath that connects the corner room on the left to besides the stairs on the right. Make the corridor tight and put sound clues there, maybe shards from above, just keep the small health above next to the windows.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image10.jpg[/lvlshot]
Replace the second PG with a second RL instead. I would personally raise the whole area up but it may not be practical for brushwork you got there already. Place the RL at the back and no extra ammo packs either.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image11.jpg[/lvlshot]
move the JP further back so there is a ledge to land on above, the space there is too tight and the shard/health behind the JP is dubious, I would use them elsewhere, maybe where you got the mega crate with the +25 health instead.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image12.jpg[/lvlshot]
Create an alternative jump route up with crates or pipes. So if you are chasing someone you can go up the crates while they go the stairs. Move the RL ammo to the bottom of the stairs for route temptation.
[lvlshot]http://www.simonoc.com/images/misc/fkd_tedge/image13.jpg[/lvlshot]
Personally I don't like the RL deadend here, it feels awkward and I want the end of the corridor to go somewhere. I would recommend connecting it via JP to the corner room on the left. So if you see someone go for the RL you can cut them off in the corner room with a shotgun to the face as they come up the JP :P
You have broken shaders and console error messages that need to be fixed before you can release anything. I am sure you know how to track them down.
I love some of the detail you have created but the map feels like it lacks a theme, a direction, you have so many tech styles mashed together the map has no identity. If was to describe your map to someone I would say, yeah tech crazy detail and that is it. The map lacks a central feature, vista, wow viewpoint (maybe the big window, docking area idea, screenshot2 above) but you need something. The map feels like you have been creating loads of small sections of detail and then sowing them together with no thought for the bigger picture (the theme). It feels like you have been making a suit and forgot what you wanted to end up with and have 10 arms, 20 legs and no torso! :P
The lighting feels very flat to me, like you are using a high ambient value. Also you have so many different coloured lights it feels likes a disco in places. (I am sure PlanB will love it! but it still feels too gaudy to me) I would recommend you pick three base colours and stick to them throughout the map. Use colour to accent height, for example; yellow->low, blue->high. Save your third colour for marking areas that are special or important, so when the player finds the colour they can recognise it. Pick your colours and location and you will find naviagation will improve subconsciously.
Sound clues, I found the constant wind annoying, turn it into gusts and set it up via delays so it feels more natural and not a constant blast noise. Q3 is pretty bad for sound placement and areas because it is difficult to confine to special areas, so use less. Make sure certain areas have special sounds, like a deep bass sound for the PG location, a good dripping echo sound for the water for example. Take each atrium and create something unique soundwise for each so that players will feel the difference.
That is a lot of waffle and don't take what I say to heart, hope it helps.
Well he was evil, but he did build alot of roads. - Gogglor
My [url=http://www.simonoc.com/]Website[/url] & [url=http://twitter.com/SimsOCallaghan]Twitter[/url]
woah! great advice, cheers man, i've printed it off and will do some major work when i get home, thanks so much! its really good to get some really solid feedback
[nitpick] It looks like you need some sort of weight or something on the other side of that crane to counteract the weight of the crane arm and load. [/nitpick]
obsidian wrote:It looks like you need some sort of weight or something on the other side of that crane to counteract the weight of the crane arm and load..
Your work looks amazing and the depth of detail is fantastic, especially the new bay window and loading bay. I would strongly suggest you photo source a crane for the architectural shape (like obsidian mentioned) so you can get the right balance. I am not suggesting go total realism, but just gently hint it and the viewer/player will fill in the rest of the gaps for you.
Well he was evil, but he did build alot of roads. - Gogglor
My [url=http://www.simonoc.com/]Website[/url] & [url=http://twitter.com/SimsOCallaghan]Twitter[/url]
ding ding update. ok have at it r_speeds are high... its the nature of the level, i've sure most of you have nice shiny computers.. god im sick of working on a lap top lol
Last edited by fKd on Sun Aug 02, 2009 6:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Holy crap! Impressive stuff.
Couple of little observations:
Firstly I have missing textures, the bevel ceiling around the rail gun area.
Secondly, I know this has been said before, the dripping water. It's a bit regulary and linear. May be use particles? I know Q3 doesn't support them, but it can be faked, I've done it with bubbles and snow flakes before. Just might be able to get some more variation in the drips. Some ripples as the drips hit would be cool too.
If you spectate in the GL room you can get just high enough to see the caulked top of the area that hosts the GL.
I know this would probably screw up the playability of the map, but a control panel where you could move something on the crane would be really nice
Frame rate for me was pretty good. At worst around the 200 mark. With that much detail r_speeds are always going to be an issue I guess, if it was me I wouldn't worry about it.
Finally...just what a brilliant effort, hugely impressive.
I tried to download this and the pk3 was corrupt, will have to try again tomorrow.
Well he was evil, but he did build alot of roads. - Gogglor
My [url=http://www.simonoc.com/]Website[/url] & [url=http://twitter.com/SimsOCallaghan]Twitter[/url]
