Can you imagine the shithemorrhage the tea-party would have if a democratic governor put a "show me your papers" law into effect? Legal immigrants can spend up to 6 months in jail if they don't have proper paperwork, apparently. I kept thinking this law couldn't be as bad as the media was making it sound, but it looks like its actually worse. And economically it is shaping up to be an incredibly bad decision.
I saw a Rep senator from Arizona (who supported it) on one of the talking head shows last night. He appeared to be sweating, and the best defense he could muster was some nebulous idea that immigrants just like to break the law and commit violent crimes at every opportunity. He also tried to say that this bill would only allow police to ask people for proof of citizenship after they had been stopped for a crime, which apparently is not true at all (heck, can't they do that already?).
What's really going to be depressing though, is if all those republican senators get reelected again due to the contagious ignorance of right-wing supporters these days.
The sad thing is that here in the Netherlands, it's already a required by law to carry ID (passport, ID card or driver's license) with you at all times (for people over 13 years of age). If a police officer asks you for ID and you can't show it, he can fine you for it. I don't think jail time is involved here though.
The whole illegal immigrant thing isn't as much a hot topic here in the Netherlands of course, and in practice you won't be asked for ID if there's not an initial reason to do so, but in theory it's still possible for a policeman to ask random people for their ID and fine them if they can't show it.
R00k wrote:What's really going to be depressing though, is if all those republican senators get reelected again due to the contagious ignorance of right-wing supporters these days.
you might as well /wrist
It's not an if situation. This country is filling with angry, idiot fucktards, and the projections are sizable loses for democrats in the fall.
Even the elite conservatives are bailing because the faux-news style rhetoric is just so off from reality. Google "epistemic closure".
Eraser wrote:The sad thing is that here in the Netherlands, it's already a required by law to carry ID (passport, ID card or driver's license) with you at all times (for people over 13 years of age). If a police officer asks you for ID and you can't show it, he can fine you for it. I don't think jail time is involved here though.
The whole illegal immigrant thing isn't as much a hot topic here in the Netherlands of course, and in practice you won't be asked for ID if there's not an initial reason to do so, but in theory it's still possible for a policeman to ask random people for their ID and fine them if they can't show it.
Eraser wrote:The sad thing is that here in the Netherlands, it's already a required by law to carry ID (passport, ID card or driver's license) with you at all times (for people over 13 years of age). If a police officer asks you for ID and you can't show it, he can fine you for it. I don't think jail time is involved here though.
The whole illegal immigrant thing isn't as much a hot topic here in the Netherlands of course, and in practice you won't be asked for ID if there's not an initial reason to do so, but in theory it's still possible for a policeman to ask random people for their ID and fine them if they can't show it.
didn't we drive the nazis out of holland in 1944?
innit.
eraser is leaving an important part out tho - they cant 'randomly' ask you for ID. there has to be suspicion of misdemeanor or criminal activity.
you can actually fight them on this and you will win if they cant show cause, rofl.
in practice they only ask for ID when they fine you , which is legally justified.
That's why I said that in practice you won't be asked for ID. I wasn't sure if criminal activity was a requirement for them to ask for ID. How well is this defined for real though? You say that suspicion could be enough. Who defines what is suspicious enough to warrant an ID check?
Also, talk about ID checks for "high risk" events are more and more common. Again, I'm not sure if that has already been put to practice but it's possible.
Think it's up to the cops on the scene... like, with football matches there's a hightened risk of hooligans and they can check ID's. Or sometimes they'll do preventive searches / ID checks in crime ridden neighbourhoods, which they don't need to announce or anything.
Funny story: there's a bar near my house that got raided a while ago, they suspected it was being used by a group of criminals for money laundering purposes or serious drug dealing or something. They ended up arresting nearly everybody in the place because as it turned out, virtually everyone there was an illegal alien with no ID to show. But then when they got to court everyone except the few criminals they caught were released because they're not allowed to 'hunt illegals' with the ID law.
Which imo is fantasically ridiculous reasoning in this case... but yeah, that's how strict they are with it.
This bill is bogus. I understand the motivation behind it, but why should naturalized citizens carry copies of their certificate? Seems to defeat the purpose....
they've had this in russia since forever. ppl gotta have their passport with them all the time, since they're checking for illegal immigrants and people who are trying to avoid being conscripted
I got the thing up to about 120 mph on I-10 last night. Fortunately, I didn't get pulled over and being asked for my papers (didn't bring any anyway)...at least not yet
