Question on func_group

[dghost77]

I was reading the definition of the func_group from the GtkRadiant manual because I wanted to use it for grouping some entities together and I discovered that I cannot group entities, just brushes so far. Okay, that answered my first question. But beside that the GtkRadiant manual simply say :

func_group
Map Entity Color: Light blue
Dimensions: Determined by dimensions of map components.
Game Function: This is not an entity. It is strictly an editor utility to group world brushes and patches together for convenience (selecting, moving, copying, etc). You cannot group entities with this.

And I think I remembered reading somewhere that @ compile time, the func_group is ignored. But I found back an old word doc from Paul Jacquay about Terrain Construction for Quake 3 Engine Games, the doc was converted to html by astrocreep, it can be found here. I think that document was created from Team Arena and it looks like the func_group was created from there with the following def :

· A variant of the func_group entity has been added to the game. When a func_group of brushes (only) is given a terrain key and a numerical value (an ID number for that terrain) and several other key attributes, it becomes a terrain entity and is treated differently than other brushes during the compile.

@ this place in the doc the func_group is an entity with keys and values for it, it's being used for terrain information.

Are the 2 definition true? I mean can I work with a simple group of brushes if I don't give the group any keys/values?

[Fjoggs]

What excactly are you asking? :P
You can apply stuff like _lightmapscale to func_groups for example.

[dghost77]

Originally I wanted to group some brushes that would be transformed to func_bobbing entities and give it all the same values for a specific group and some others value to another group, but it seems that I cannot do that with entities for func_group.

And then I read from the other manual of Paul Jacquay that the func_group is being used as entities for terrain information in a Team Arena map.

In your example, is _lightmapscale an entity or not? I am a little bit confused on how to work with func_group.

[Fjoggs]

_lightmapscale is a key that you can give to for example func_groups.
Can't you simply create the func_bobbing you want and duplicate it? Don't see why you have to group it.
Atleast in 1.5 you can't select all the grouped brushes anyway, you can only select one brush at a time so you don't save any time making it into a group.
Create a prefab if you wanna do something like that.

[dghost77]

Ah okay! I thought that I could select the whole group with one click, I am using zeroradiant tough. I will have to check that. I though from the beginning that the func_group was only a feature to work with a group of brushes and that the entity was ignored @ compiled time, I never knew that it could also be used as a terrain entity and that we could applies keys on it.

[dghost77]

In my case I cannot simply duplicate my brushes that are func_bobbing because they are all of different shape and size. You are right, I could have achieved what I wanted with a prefab, didn't though of that. But my brushes location would have to be right on spot with this method, which sadly, they are not at the moment. Not the end of the world, I'll just manage them individually.

[Eraser]

Fjoggs, the _lightmapscale key is something that q3map2 reads, not Quake 3 itself.

func_group actually is an entity and Quake 3 recognizes it as such as well. However, Quake 3 dismisses the entity as soon as the map is loaded. So it won't have any functional effect in Quake 3 itself. Quake 3 actually treats func_group as if it were an info_null entity.

So for all means and purposes, func_group is nothing more than a way of grouping brushes together in the editor with the added possibility of specifying q3map2 specific keys. I think the terrain stuff Paul Jacquays wrote about is something that's handled by q3map as well.

[DaEngineer]

Atleast in 1.5 you can't select all the grouped brushes anyway, you can only select one brush at a time so you don't save any time making it into a group.

Oh yes, you can. Select one brush of the entity and press CTRL+ALT+E and all brushes become selected.

[Fjoggs]

Gasp! I never knew that. Awkward hotkey though.
This actually makes groups useful. Cheers!

[dghost77]

Ah ok, so this is working at least for group selecting, it was one of the main reason that I wanted to use it.

[Theftbot]

PPL need to read before posting,mapping:

http://www.quake3world.com/forum/viewto ... 10&t=42049

[Eraser]

Does such a hotkey exist in GtkRadian 1.4 as well?

[deqer]

Does such a hotkey exist in GtkRadian 1.4 as well?

Tried it. Did not appear to work. Could not find it in the Shortcuts list either. Only way I know is by flipping through all them in the entities window "L", and when I find the right one, press Select button.

[obsidian]

Selecting all brushes of an entity:
1.5: CTRL + ALT + E
1.4/1.6: CTRL + ALT + LMB

[deqer]

Wow, that's great. Thanks obsidian.

[dghost77]

I'm using GtkR 1.6 - ZeroR and the shortcut for selecting all the same entities is not working for me, that is the CTRL+ALT+LMB. Anybody else with ZeroR can confirm this?

[obsidian]

It doesn't select all the same entities, it selects all the brushes as part of that single entity (like a func_group of multiple brushes).

[dghost77]

Aaaah ok. thx!

[deqer]

I'm using GtkR 1.6 - ZeroR and the shortcut for selecting all the same entities is not working for me

Try pressing Shift+A after you selected the first entity. I found this out from the link (above) by Theftbot.

[dghost77]

Thx! Going through right now. I only read the func_group entry yesterday from it.