Just remember folks, I called this. immortality.

[Κracus]

...despite my thoughts on the value of having a piece of paper that says you know something, knowing something itself is worthwhile.

you mean to say i learned something to go with my piece of paper?

hot diggety!

No... That's not necessarily what I was saying, more like what I hoped happened.

[Κracus]

I find the best way to stop stupidity in its tracks is to make fun of it. In any normal person, being laughed at will piss them off, but can also motivate them to educate themselves on the subject so they fare better next time.

Hey fatass... well I think you get the idea.

[GONNAFISTYA]

I am a fat ass...because I willed it to be.
You are a moron...because I, not you, willed it to be.
And since your argument allows for miracles, the miracle is: you are still a moron.

Obvious disagreement in at least one of those statements. So who's universe are we living in?

[GONNAFISTYA]

You should go read a book called The Holographic Universe by Michael Talbot. While it's quite far-fetched (touches on a lot of stuff Kracus is talking about), he does make a pretty compelling case for a lot of strange ideas. Whether or not the Universe is a construct of the human consciousness is a pretty hard thing to justify or explain but there are clues that point to something reminiscent of this....

I forgot to link this earlier this afternoon. It was from last summer:

We May Not Live in a Hologram After All

GEO600 — a mindbogglingly sensitive piece of kit — started to detect what particle physicist Craig Hogan interpreted as quantum “fuzziness.” This fuzziness, or blurriness on the smallest possible scales, could be interpreted as evidence for the “holographic universe” hypothesis...

...However, as announced this week, a space-borne European satellite that should be able to measure these small scales too, doesn’t appear to be registering any quantum fuzziness. In fact, it has yet to detect anything quantum, indicating that spacetime’s “graininess” is composed of quanta that a lot smaller than predicted — and in my view, puts a question mark over the interpretation of the GEO600 results.

And here: The universe probably isn’t a giant hologram after all

One of the strangest and most exotic theories to come out of theoretical physics is that the entire universe is a projection of a two-dimensional shell. But the latest evidence suggests the cosmic hologram really is just a crazy theory...

...new results have come in from the European Space Agency's Integral gamma-ray observatory, whose instruments are just as precise as those of the GEO 600. The observatory can measure gamma-ray bursts, and depending on their behavior it can determine whether the universe really does become "grainy" at super-small scales. The observatory has measured an extremely bright gamma-ray burst as it traveled 300 million light-years towards Earth, and the results were unmistakable: there were no signs of blurriness.

Not proof either way, but I'll treat the hologram theory's evidence as I treat the evidence for Bigfoot. I guess the main reason why I feel so strongly that it's bunk (besides the fact that it's science-based thinking) is that it allows for so much craziness to sneak in unchallenged, such as out-of-body experiences, etc that I've rolled my eyes at since I was 9 years old.

I'm sorry (and this will probably make steam come out of Kracus' ears) but the evidence is leaning to the conclusion that the universe isn't someone's thought experiment and that the universe probably would have happened anyway.

[Tsakali]

I agree, and frankly I commend yet laugh at you for even wasting so much time explaining off such ridiculous ideas to begin with.

this type of pseudo science is potentially even more dangerous than flat out made up religious nonsense, simply because they attempt to sneak logic and explanation in there, and they somehow think they are doing proper science.

In the odd case that anything like this is eventually proven to be correct, well guess what...get used to being ridiculed till then, cause real science builds up gradually on solid foundations of years and years of methodical hard / grinding work.

[Whiskey 7]

Gee, got to read this topic again . . . .

[TruthfulLiar]

wee can life forevar.

it's twoo. i swears it.

[TruthfulLiar]

This is exponential (plotted next to linear):



If you keep charting that exponential curve, you can imagine a point where the slope of the curve will be pointing straight up. The significance of that is that if you think of it as a yearly progression, there will be a year where technology improves so much that it is infinitely great - greater than the whole sum of all human history combined.

Besides, the book does go over various other technological advances, even looking at human history as a whole. The time-frame between social revolutions has shortened at each iteration at an exponential rate. As far as hitting limits (such as physical die size of processors), he refers to how at each point in history where we hit a supposed limit, we end up jumping paradigms (such as to 3D transistors, quantum computing, etc.) and continuing that same trend. Processors are just an example used since it is one that we are most aware of, and it's not just some freak accident of a curve that only represents a briefer stretch of history like the digital revolution. His point is that a similar trend has been ongoing for all of human history.

i guess i had another reason for bringing this up, kind of. but it still follows, but in a tame and pale attempt to possibly change your mind about something about like thinking from a different perspective other than the one you read in a book. might be interesting?

[TruthfulLiar]

goes ans followes.

--- paste d text from yesterday or two days ago... whatever. lets see

---

Right. (But what is he trying to prove? Isn't it all sort of obvious? I say this now, after reading his book. But live life long enough and I think you would probably see it too. That life grows and everything keeps on increasing, by some measure.) And then it will keep on rising. Or plateau somehow. I am saying maybe we are observing everything from the peak of a curve (because we see everything in retrospect, all we can account for is the *past* and see where we are now - statistics giving us a kind of measuring stick to then make guesses) and perhaps it could even change tack and go in the reverse direction. Theoretically anything is possible, a bronie could fall from the sky and land on you. But without getting obtuse, this is what I wonder, consider instead of an exponential curve, look at it as a standard curve. What is normal (middle) is large percent and is what we consider historical and current technology. It is the large percent because that is what we know or have experienced more of. (Dangling participle?) What we don't know or have little experience of is the smaller percent (but not outliers) and are what can be considered as the future or the awesome-possum technology of our times including the potential or foreseeable outcomes of our advancements. I am saying look at it this way because we may be at what we think is the peaking, but in fact could be farther away from whatever this "infinitely great" or *limitless*? place may be or represent. As a standard curve - OK. What I am trying to describe is central tendency, and that we draw from our statistical data (ie: events) and then create an average. But, taken in time, say 100 years from now, looking back, the average will appear different than it does now.

I think a very misleading concept is exponential growth. It is used in many places. Especially business school. I really have a hard time imagining a place that allows for exponential growth of anything. Unless we're somehow in a wave-icle thing talking about energy, matter, and electromagnetism. But then that is either nothing or everything and then it doesn't matter. Probably. Maybe. Not sure though.

What that exponential growth chart looks like to me is the first half of this .

Also.

Amount of technological innovations over time being X.

I know it is technically not (the same time); what it makes me think about is looking at the same data Ray does but from a statistical perspective using the same examples for the central tendency and the deviations from the mean as the potential (or growth). Things have a tendency (also statistical term) towards leveling out (not a statistical term) over time. Deviations becomes more intense but less frequent and what is normal becomes more frequent but less intense.

I will make another example (or maybe the first). I was looking through wikipedia the other day seeing how many revolutions and wars we have had. Short to say, a lot. Including revolts, etc... It is mind boggling how many we have had.

But the number of deaths, seems, apparently (without doing actual data sets) to go down. Frequency rises, number of deaths decreases. In one sense it is a leveling out. Same difference really.

Still all a flat 0 in the end. Or 1. Not sure.

PS. So kracus says he called it, but didn't really?

---

edn paste:

and i haven't checked for smepplign issues.

[TruthfulLiar]

you know its bad when the charts have to come outa

[TruthfulLiar]

for anyone who doesnt know

how to read - (geoff): i;m sorry. j/k - charts: i'm also sorry. becauase i don;t explain them at all well either. guess I don't attempt to. take down.

[GONNAFISTYA]

Are you a meth head?

[TruthfulLiar]

no... just regular smokeables

that aren't that regular, or are they
.?

[TruthfulLiar]

can i upload a photo here my iphone?

[TruthfulLiar]

i;m on a mactop pro but i want to photo up here from iphone

[Captain]

Are you a meth head?

No he's a pathetic loser who should kill himself.

[TruthfulLiar]

lack of sleepreally staying aling,...

[TruthfulLiar]

ok should i film it and send the link to you?

[TruthfulLiar]

first tell me how to upload a video on this forum from my iphone andd then il'l think about to do it

[seremtan]

i can't believe you kept a dormant account since dec 2005 just for this shit

[Jackal]

Just here to remind everyone that Kracus is an idiot.

[GONNAFISTYA]

Holy fuck they let you out of prison? Are they crazy?

[Dark Metal]

Oh look, more Canadians. Just what we need.

[plained]

eeeyyy he a 22end'er!!

[Plan B]

Just Jackal reminding everyone that everything that has been done/will be done is/will be an exercise in futility.

/back to smugg hibernation.