q3a mod: slugs and rockets

[Takkie]

All right then.
I have some small test maps wich i can convert to 3, 4, 5 and 6 team maps.
I'll have a go at that sounds like fun.
What's the 'entity-name' of the green, gold, cyan and pink flag?

I will also check for some announcer sounds...
I did something similar for the railor-mod.
We used the 't' from 'tank-jr' announcer and the 'ags' from the 'frags' announcer sound to form 'tags'.

In UT's 4-team ctf the scoring goes something like this (iirc):
Each team starts with four flags.
When another team captures your flag your team has three flags left.
When your team captures another teams flag you recieve that flag as a score.
When all your flags are captured your team is out of the game, the other teams fight on.
The team that is last in the game wins.
So it's something like last-team standing CTF.
If the time is over before all teams are out, the team with most captures wins...
Is it a tie then the team with the least flag stolen wins, still a tie... 'sudden-death'.

[UglyFoot]

It really takes time to get used to this. Every time i work with GitBash, GitHub, minGW32, Msys it feels like 'the first time'. I try to work as clean as possible.

Yeah, Git can be very annoying.

I'll get hang the hang of it and hope not to make (m)any 'mistakes' anymore.

We're going to do them anyway, law of life

I'll change the "You fragged [playername] for [position nr.] place" message into a smaller (less 'annoying') one.

What about moving it to a higher position?

I have done the changes you suggested. This time I've pushed them to the test branch since I have not tested them in depth and I want to avoid to push future fixes to master branch if they have some bug.

I'm looking forward to a config menu, I'll have it done soon, it starts to annoy me to change everything from the console.

[themuffinman]

What's the 'entity-name' of the green, gold, cyan and pink flag?

ENTITIES:
---------
team_CTF_greenflag
team_CTF_goldflag
team_CTF_cyanflag
team_CTF_pinkflag
team_CTF_greenplayer
team_CTF_goldplayer
team_CTF_cyanplayer
team_CTF_pinkplayer
team_CTF_greenspawn
team_CTF_goldspawn
team_CTF_cyanspawn
team_CTF_pinkspawn

WORLDSPAWN KEYS:
----------------
maxTeams [0/2-6]: forces maximum number of teams supported by map
minTeams [0/2-6]: forces minimum number of teams supported by map

The server also uses g_minTeams and g_maxTeams cvars (bounded to the above worldspawn keys where applicable). Also, the number of teams depends on a static team color order of red, blue, green, gold, cyan, magenta; so a maxTeams of 4 would give you red, blue, green, gold. I considered making it possible to choose team colors but it could just complicate things unnecessarily.

Some of the other entities which have spawnflags for red and blue team (eg: target_relay, target_remove_powerups, target_print) now also have flags for the other teams. Since & 4 is usually taken by another flag, it starts at 8:
& 8 : GREEN
& 16 : GOLD
& 32 : CYAN
& 64 : MAGENTA

In UT's 4-team ctf

I remember 4-team DOM and TDM but never saw 4-team CTF maps... was it in a mod? Elimination CTF does sound good though. Only drawback I can see is the bases of the eliminated teams could be hide-outs for flag carriers etc., but maybe a couple of trigger entities could close up those bases and teleport everyone inside to their own bases.

[Takkie]

Quote:
I'll change the "You fragged [playername] for [position nr.] place" message into a smaller (less 'annoying') one.

What about moving it to a higher position?

I will position it a the top of the screen, above the reward icons.
I'll push the commit to the master branch soon.

I have done the changes you suggested. This time I've pushed them to the test branch since I have not tested them in depth and I want to avoid to push future fixes to master branch if they have some bug.

I've briefly checked it out in ffa and it works like a charm so far.
I did a quick check in ctf and the weapons don't 'load' and/or 'are out of ammo'.
I'll give you a more extensive test-'report' later (will check tourney and tdm too)...

ENTITIES:
---------
team_CTF_greenflag
team_CTF_goldflag
team_CTF_cyanflag
team_CTF_pinkflag
team_CTF_greenplayer
team_CTF_goldplayer
team_CTF_cyanplayer
team_CTF_pinkplayer
team_CTF_greenspawn
team_CTF_goldspawn
team_CTF_cyanspawn
team_CTF_pinkspawn

WORLDSPAWN KEYS:
----------------
maxTeams [0/2-6]: forces maximum number of teams supported by map
minTeams [0/2-6]: forces minimum number of teams supported by map

The server also uses g_minTeams and g_maxTeams cvars (bounded to the above worldspawn keys where applicable). Also, the number of teams depends on a static team color order of red, blue, green, gold, cyan, magenta; so a maxTeams of 4 would give you red, blue, green, gold. I considered making it possible to choose team colors but it could just complicate things unnecessarily.

Some of the other entities which have spawnflags for red and blue team (eg: target_relay, target_remove_powerups, target_print) now also have flags for the other teams. Since & 4 is usually taken by another flag, it starts at 8:
& 8 : GREEN
& 16 : GOLD
& 32 : CYAN
& 64 : MAGENTA

Great!
I'll see if i'm able to create an entity-file for Gtk, never done this but could be fun and usefull to go with the mod for other map-authors.

I remember 4-team DOM and TDM but never saw 4-team CTF maps... was it in a mod? Elimination CTF does sound good though. Only drawback I can see is the bases of the eliminated teams could be hide-outs for flag carriers etc., but maybe a couple of trigger entities could close up those bases and teleport everyone inside to their own bases.

I believe they used a trigger to seal the base of an eliminated team too.
It was for ut2004
here's a link: http://ctf4.apartment167.com/
and this one was for ut: http://www.uncommonplace.com/games/ctf4.html

[UglyFoot]

I did a quick check in ctf and the weapons don't 'load' and/or 'are out of ammo'.

I forgot about the other modes, now it should be fixed. This makes me think I should rename cg_ffaWeaponMode to cg_weaponMode, which would be used for ffa, sp and tourney, what do you think?

Nice job muffin, I like the "stealing" points idea.

[Takkie]

Hmmm, cg_weaponMode is perhaps a bit misleading because it doesn't function in team-games. I was wondering about cg_freeWeaponMode or cg_pWeaponMode (p for personal or private).
An other thing i ran into is that in ctf when a flag carrier gets fragged, the flag disappears.
It doesn't drop. But when a flagcarrier drops in the void it does respawns at the flagbase.
This happens in the mastet and test branch, i checked that.

I pushed the "you fragged [player] for place...", to the test branch.

[Takkie]

@themuffinman

Some of the other entities which have spawnflags for red and blue team (eg: target_relay, target_remove_powerups, target_print) now also have flags for the other teams. Since & 4 is usually taken by another flag, it starts at 8:
& 8 : GREEN
& 16 : GOLD
& 32 : CYAN
& 64 : MAGENTA

I created an entity file for gtk using your descriptions.
Some side notes:
"target_remove_powerups", in the original entity file i couldn't find a reveral in this entity to the red_team or blue_team so i skipped this.
"& 64 : MAGENTA", you mean PINK i suppose at least that is what i used.
If we want to lock down bases after a team is eliminated we need to create an entity for that.
So this entity file isn't final.
Here's a link to the file: SlugRock-entities.zip
Unzipped/copy it (with folders on) in your Quake3 folder wich GtkRadiant uses.
In Gtk go to File project settings
set basepath to: yourpath/SlugRock/
selectmod: Custom Quake III modification
fsgame: SlugRock

Additional info: The entity file is called entities.def if i use another name the models (playerspawns etc.) don't show up correctly.

[UglyFoot]

Good, for my part just tell us I have pushed a little fix for the ctf bug and a little improvement for the "you fragged..." message position to get tested. If it's ok I'll tidy the test branch and merge it with master.

By the way, merry christmas

[Takkie]

Ok, I'll check it out and let you know. And merry christmas!
Cheers

[Takkie]

I have pushed a little fix for the ctf bug and a little improvement for the "you fragged..." message position to get tested. If it's ok I'll tidy the test branch and merge it with master.

When i compiled the qvm's i got this warning:
g_combat.c:108: warning: unreachable code
The compiler still build the game.qvm so i could test it in-game.

The CenterPrint/"you fragged..." message is much better this way. Very nice improvement.

After playing tdm and ctf for some time i missed the possibility of setting the cvar g_forceWeaponMode (alternate, random, rl, rg and "")
Now you can't play railgun only or rl-only in team games (or "alternate" / "random" either).
Perhaps it is more 'natural' or 'in line with the rest of the gametypes' to have the same cvar choices (cg_WeaponMode and g_forceWeaponMode) as in ffa and tourney for tdm and ctf. The default cvar setting ("") would be like how it is now, that you choose your weapon and you play with that during the whole match.

This also means that the cvar cg_ffaWeaponMode can be changed to cg_WeaponMode wich makes more sense too.

I also noticed that if you want to set the cvar back to default you have to type:
/set cg_freeWeaponMode ""
While setting it to alternate/random/rl/rg you don't use the "".
Maybe the "" setting can be changed to "default"?
So by typing
/set cg_freeWeaponMode default
it wil be default.
I mention this because in the console i hardly ever used "" for a cvar setting before.

What do you think about it?
btw. the flag dropping works now!
Cheers

[UglyFoot]

After playing tdm and ctf for some time i missed the possibility of setting the cvar g_forceWeaponMode (alternate, random, rl, rg and "")
Now you can't play railgun only or rl-only in team games (or "alternate" / "random" either).

I've done a quick test and it doesn't happen to me, I'll check it better later.

Perhaps it is more 'natural' or 'in line with the rest of the gametypes' to have the same cvar choices (cg_WeaponMode and g_forceWeaponMode) as in ffa and tourney for tdm and ctf. The default cvar setting ("") would be like how it is now, that you choose your weapon and you play with that during the whole match.

This also means that the cvar cg_ffaWeaponMode can be changed to cg_WeaponMode wich makes more sense too.

Yes, it makes more sense, I'll change it.

I also noticed that if you want to set the cvar back to default you have to type:
/set cg_freeWeaponMode ""
While setting it to alternate/random/rl/rg you don't use the "".
Maybe the "" setting can be changed to "default"?
So by typing
/set cg_freeWeaponMode default
it wil be default.
I mention this because in the console i hardly ever used "" for a cvar setting before.

Ok.

I noticed that when I create a tdm game it doesn't join to the team I've selected before creating the game. I checked out the first commit I did, and it happens too, though I didn't do any change to the code in that commit. Also I replaced the config with the ioq3's config and it keeps happening even though I doesn't happen in ioq3. Does this happen to you too?

[Takkie]

I noticed that when I create a tdm game it doesn't join to the team I've selected before creating the game. I checked out the first commit I did, and it happens too, though I didn't do any change to the code in that commit. Also I replaced the config with the ioq3's config and it keeps happening even though I doesn't happen in ioq3. Does this happen to you too?

Yes it happens to me too.
When starting a ctf or tdm game you always start as spectator (you can select blue or red team).
When you start following a player you can only join the opposite team of the player you were following.
So when following a red player you can only join the blue team and visa versa.
It happens to me with the master and and the test code.
For me it started when you added the weapon selection in the ingame team-menu code.

Quote Takkie:
After playing tdm and ctf for some time i missed the possibility of setting the cvar g_forceWeaponMode (alternate, random, rl, rg and "")
Now you can't play railgun only or rl-only in team games (or "alternate" / "random" either).

UglyFoot wrote:
I've done a quick test and it doesn't happen to me, I'll check it better later.

My fault, i checked it again and it works.
I think i restarted the match instead of restarting the map after changing the weaponMode.
So no need to check that.

[themuffinman]

Sorry about the lack of progress, been pretty busy over the last few weeks. I might just upload the multiteam source to its own repo for the time being so others can have a go at it. It must be about 80% done now.

[Takkie]

Sorry about the lack of progress, been pretty busy over the last few weeks. I might just upload the multiteam source to its own repo for the time being so others can have a go at it. It must be about 80% done now.

No problem.
Good idea, the multiteam idea/source would be great in other mods too.
So to make it available in its own repo and others can build upon it makes sense.

I think about releasing the ioq3-SlugRock (beta)version when UglyFoot commits his last changes/additions.
So no pressure for the multi-team all in their own time

Happy New Year and best wishes btw.

[UglyFoot]

I've done the changes you said.

Now cg_weaponMode default value is "select" since I thought that "default" doesn't say much about what it actually does.

I've also added a word for g_forceWeaponMode, which is "no", to let the cg_weaponMode (or bot_weaponMode) decide the weapon mode. "no" is the default value for g_forceWeaponMode. Well, actually I've added two words: "no" and "select".

It's a good idea uploading your work muf, I'll see if I can help.

Happy new year

[Takkie]

The cvar's work great!
Very nice.
I'll write a readme.txt that will explain them.

When i compiled the qvm's i got this warning:
g_combat.c:106: warning: unreachable code
This warning changed from 108 in the previous version to 106 in this version.
Does this need to be fixed?

btw.
Are you perhaps working on a menu to set the cvar's from the ui?

I'm asking this because i'm thinking about 'releasing' a ioq3 version of SlugRock.
At least before we add aditional features (like multi-team for example).

[UglyFoot]

No, the warning doesn't really need to be fixed but I think I'll fix it just to remove the warning.

Yes, I was working on that menu, I believe I'll able to finish it in some days. Also I have to clean the test branch and merge it with master. I'll try to do these things soon.

[Takkie]

Looking forward to it

[UglyFoot]

Me too but I still need to do some work, I'll finish it as soon as I can.

[UglyFoot]

Sorry for the waiting, I have little time to do this and I have some troubles with git, mainly because of my bad workflow. The menu is already done but I want to reorganize it properly before uploading it. The same happens with the test branch, I'm learning some things in the hard way but at least I'm learning

[Takkie]

no problem.

I recognize the little amount of time and issues with git...

Can i have your opinion about something?
The thing is, i find the bots a bit to easy.
SlugRock shows their (relatively) poor handeling of the railgun and rocketlauncher.
It is very noticeable when you have the rl and you encounter a bot with the rg.
The bot's movement is ok but its aiming is poor.
On hardcore they'll shoot somewhat near you, on nightmare they are just a little better.

What i'd like is that the difficulty setting would resemble the bots skill more accurate.
'I can win' means 'you can win' but the bots are still a bit of an opponent.
'Bring it on' means interesting match, not to stressfull and the player will most likely be the winner.
'Hurt me plenty' means you'll get hurt plenty and you have to work hard to win.
'Hardcore' means very skillfull bots, with great accuracy and a fierce fire-throttle.
'nightmare' means un-beatable like in a nightmare... Extremely skilled with flawless accuracy.
This is a break from the difficulty settings in normal q3.
For me the original 'hardcore' bots are interesting and with not to much stress i can beat 'em.
With this in mind i played with the original bot-coding a bit.

If you follow the bots in '1st person view' you'll get dizzy after a short time.
In the bot-code there is some shaking added to the bots aiming.
I removed this shaking code, lowered the aiming fault on moving targets, and used some of the bot_challenge code for normal 'higher-skilled' bots.
These bots are (to me) better opponents.
(the bot_challenge code is still intact and it can be used to upgrade the difficulty of the bot even more)
Still not near the settings i described above but perhaps they don't need to be.
(they are much like the bots in SlugRock_4.21, with a few small changes)

Do you find the bots a bit to easy too?
Should we leave the bots like they are now, or do they need improvement?
Do you have any ideas about coding better bots (perhaps even use new code instead of tinkering with the original), or can i commit my tweaked code...

[UglyFoot]

Of course, you can commit it, just make it in the test branch so we'll be able to reorganize it if it gets dirty, before merging it with the master branch. Even though I still need to do this with the current state of the test branch (...) it shouldn't be a problem.

About the bots skill, I've not played much recently but I think they were easy too. Anyway I think that any changes could be a good addition so feel free to tinker with it. I can't say much for now, I'll just focus on the delayed work. Have fun!

[themuffinman]

I made a multiteam repo and tried committing to it but, alas, Git/GitBash is playing mind games with me and I have a severe lack of patience for this right now. So for any interested parties I zipped 'em up and uploaded instead:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/r4u09 ... titeam.zip
http://www.mediafire.com/download/l4e7g ... assets.zip

Code changes are between '//multiteam' and '//-multiteam' comments. Items todo can be found by searching for '//multiteam TODO'. Here's a summarised todo list off the top of my head:
- bot CTF code: implement bot goals to make bots select a team to attack; other bot code needs attention too
- UI is mostly untouched, probably a good idea to show team score boxes vertically
- team ranking needs doing, and in much the same way as player rankings are done (use qsort), and correctly communicated via configstrings
- assets need to be managed, announcer sounds created, ctf flag shader needs to be made (see the player skin shaders included as a reference) and applied to the code appropriately

That's mostly it I think.

[Takkie]

wow, muffinman. That's quite some work you've done.
I suggest you should start a new thread (post) here on quake3world for your efforts.
There might be others (that don't browse this thread) who would be interested in completing this.
Perhaps it's something for OpenArena or WorldOfPadman to pick it up?

[Takkie]

@UglyFoot
I just commited my bot-code adjustments to our test branch.
The bot_challenge cvar is still available and enhances the bot skill a bit more.
(perhaps you could incorporate the bot_challenge cvar also in the menu?)