UPDATE! [Q3A] [2-4 FFA Tourney] oildm1 [BETA5]

Post by **boilingoil** » Sat Apr 28, 2007 6:34 am

EDIT: Made a few changes, mostly item placement and architecture

BETA5 - redesigned for 1v1 play.
- Removed center room
- Shrank the basement
- Added GL
- Changed RG position

BETA5

Post by **dubz** » Sat Apr 28, 2007 4:19 pm

needs a whole new additional level

looks fun now, but a little too small

Post by **dichtfux** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:09 pm

Looks good! Could maybe use some ammo, +25H or sth else on the lower level to attract players. The only reason to go there atm is to get the RL.

You could also try to make the basement more attractive by putting the exit of the tele there here so it's an easy way to get YA:

Post by **boilingoil** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:42 pm

It's very easy to get it out of that tele, strafe jump! Same thing for the MH. I can do a double jump to that and to the RG.

I might make that a RA so it's more beneficial to strafe jump to it to keep the speed going.

I was thinking about making those healths down there large.

Post by **dichtfux** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:49 pm

I know you can get them easily by strafing, just thought the lower level could use some more attraction.

Making the health large may be a good idea. Maybe I'll find the time to test it against a human player in the next days. Do you have it runnung on a server?

Post by **boilingoil** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 11:11 pm

not at the moment. I've been out on the road and created this on my laptop. I could only wish sprint made an aircard fast enough to host a game! I'll be back to my desktop in the next 2 days and I'll put it up there. Is there a such thing as a place that rents out dedicated servers as if they were web servers?

Post by **boilingoil** » Wed May 02, 2007 12:11 am

[POST LINK UPDATED]
BETA3 RELEASED!

Moved a things around a bit to attract attention to the top and bottom levels, leaving traffic on the middle level also. Trying to let item placement smooth out the flow of the map.

Post by **boilingoil** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:51 am

BETA4 RELEASED!

Post by **ix-ir** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:29 pm

A little late to the party since this is now final but some things to think about in future.

No readme in the pk, this is important for anyone who wants to know anything about the map.

You missed clipping the lone decorative pillar near the SG/glass and the one on the top level near Mega.

What does glass achieve? Players can't interact but have perfect information which would seem like it removed depth without adding anything.

Some areas like the RG corridor are too narrow, you can't dodge at all and both exits are coverable by someone outside it, if you want it to be a death trap that's fine but it'd be better with at least some wiggle room inside.

Why are the jumps to Mega and RA so long? How would a new player deal with your map? Every item should be accessible via +forward and jump, having other faster routes that require skill is fine but there needs to be a simple base route.

Think about the items more. The first item issue is the control items, as far as I can see the only armour items (bar a couple of shards) are Mega health and Red armour, both of which are on the top level. One guy is most likely going to gain control of both of those, as the losing player how are you supposed to come back against an enemy with 3 to 4 times as much health as you? What items or mechanisms in the layout are there to do this?

With major items it's good practice not only to seperate them by distance but also by 'position', meaning you must always give up the high ground or change position to get both.

You've put 2 50h bubbles very close to one another on the bottom level and a 50h on the top level - it's better to spread the health around a little more and use 50h bubbles only at important focal points to draw the player there. RG ammo very near the RG.

A spawn right next to the lower level teleporter is a slightly odd placement, the spawner has a freebie escape and it can be very disorienting to spawn, press a key and teleport instantly.

Clean up some of the surfaces - the floor near the mega has an annoying stepup trim and some ceilings have pointless overhangs that will catch people who've been bounced up or try to RJ.

Don't take all this criticism as disheartening, I'm giving it because I see a lot of potential in the level, the middle area is really nice and there's a lot of potentially exciting interaction between the levels. I think you should take this level back to alpha/beta work and polish it further.

If you're interested I'd be happy to help with tweaking the map.

Post by **dichtfux** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 7:10 pm

Some very good advice there, ix!

Listen to that guy, oil!

Post by **Foo** » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:43 pm

I think the way you've approached level building is similar to me and I dig that...
I think more work on visuals would be beneficial, in terms of a higher polycount and a more complex approach to non-essential areas i.e. the ceilings and some of the walls which could withstand more detailing. I like the clean look and you chose and nice textures, colours and lights.

Gameplay wise I'm screwed as I'm on my laptop which can't handle teh quaek at anything playable.

Post by **boilingoil** » Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:49 am

Thanks for all the feedback!

BETA4

I have made a few changes, let me know what you think.

Put the readme in the pk instead of just in the zip file

I kina like the glass, yeah it gives you a way to see what's going on in the basement. I'll see what it's like without it when I release BETA5 (maybe i'll just clip the one in the room with stairs)

RG corridor is wider.

MH easier to access, and swapped the places of one of the slipgates and the RA. I also changed where it exits, making it take longer to get back to the other control item.

Ditched the 50H's in the basement, and made one a regular Health. Removed the one on the top level (should have put the RG ammo there now that i think of it...)

Moved the Basement Spawn so it's not in front of the slipgate

Added a little more space in the MH room

Post by **ix-ir** » Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:45 am

Just noticed your decals seem to be on raised platforms rather than projected using a patch and a target entity.

Your modified version takes a number of steps in the right direction. Something to think about with the way you've made the mega more reachable - wouldn't it look more natural if the mega was reachable without a platform provided for that purpose? It looks very much like what it is, added to correct something.

Something else I noticed is that the PG is at the top of a bounce pad. It's best to make the taking of items optional and not on the beaten path.

Post by **boilingoil** » Fri Jun 29, 2007 4:37 pm

How do i properly display decals?

In this next version i release, I've come up with some ideas to change the theme so that it better fits the level's design. I'm going to switch to a more tech/industrial textureset, and do a little more detail, and change the look of some rooms (nothing drastic, mostly it will just look a bit different.

I don't have any shots yet but gimme 4 more days...

Post by **obsidian** » Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:22 pm

You will need a shader with the polygonOffset directive.

You can manually place a brush or patch into the ground so that it lies flush with the floor. PolygonOffset will draw the texture above the floor even though it is coplanar.

As well, you can use the _decal entity to project the texture if the surface is non-planar (like stairs or something).

Post by **boilingoil** » Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:59 pm

I haven't read the shader manual yet, but after seeing this post I just gotta

That polygonOffset thing is new to me, but i looked into the dsi_textures shader, and didn't see that word anywhere, I guess i'll use the _decal entity in my next release.

Post by **obsidian** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:08 am

You'll still need polygonOffset for use with the _decal entity otherwise you'll likely end up with z-fighting issues.

Post by **boilingoil** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:45 am

I'd better start reading that manual then... 4 more days...

Post by **boilingoil** » Sun Jul 01, 2007 11:27 pm

Been changing a few things, here's a picture update, not ready for beta5 release yet...

Post by **obsidian** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:40 am

I don't quite like the red pipes. They look really out of place. Maybe change the colour to something much cooler, like grayish blue.

Post by **boilingoil** » Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:39 pm

Oh don't worry, they aren't staying red. I just have to figure out how to make my own textures/shaders, and they'll be some kind of pipes that pump a bluish-white fluid to some machines (i'll even give em sound). There'll be some in the basement too (i'm completely redoing it). Those grey boxes (where the light is coming out of the pipes will be retextured also. 4 more days...

Post by **boilingoil** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:19 am

Made some changes, Took out those red pipes altogether. Tightened it up and moved some items around. Check it out.

Post by **dichtfux** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:03 am

What about a JA @SG?

btw: You should maybe send tig at lvl a mail and ask him to remove your map from the final map queue.

Post by **boilingoil** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 3:45 am

JA? I dunno what that is

do you mean YA?

I've send an email through the site and from my inbox, maybe i'm sending it to the wrong place... you have the correct address?

Post by **dichtfux** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 10:10 am

boilingoil wrote:JA? I dunno what that is do you mean YA?

No. JA = Jacket Armor, the green one in CPMA and OSP. Add the CPMA entities to Radiant, then you can add 'item->armor_jacket'.

boilingoil wrote:I've send an email through the site and from my inbox, maybe i'm sending it to the wrong place... you have the correct address?

Send it to lvl@that-domain-were-talking-about.com.